300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

What do the next 8 years bring and are we being naive to even think that we will be using this technology in even five years?

There's people still happily running x86 computers. It all depends on what a person's needs/wants are.

*We* are enthusiasts, looking to push the envelope, so I don't think we accurately represent the total body of growers, who are probably more than happy if they're meeting their needs, whether large or small, no matter how old their tech is.

 

[go green]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

There's people still happily running x86 computers. It all depends on what a person's needs/wants are.

*We* are enthusiasts, looking to push the envelope, so I don't think we accurately represent the total body of growers, who are probably more than happy if they're meeting their needs, whether large or small, no matter how old their tech is.

That's a very well said comment SS.

Wise words are upon us. I am ordering up HPS ballasts to keep my room WARM!

On my end...sometimes we regress to that old technology...as the reliability is usually unparalleled to the newer.

-Go

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

I can almost taste it and it tastes like more, please!
When your journeyman 400 HPS held it's own (more or less) against the best high-tech lighting device we've seen, I began to wonder about the white light that I favor

250s, DR80s: Bantams in their bags
You're gonna love bare vertin' these bulbs, Bubba
Prolly both bumper boxes of buds

I was very impressed when I tried to run that little 150w HPS bare vertical bulb in my cab. While the temps were lower than with my 110w T5, due to the excellent flow-through ventilation without a hood in there, the plants couldn't handle the direct light and got light-stressed. I could hold my hand 1/2" away from the bulb for an hour if I wanted to, so it wasn't a heat issue, but the direct light was too much.

DR80's with 250's should rock

and the hempy/soil comparison should be interesting too.

I'm stoked

Settle on in like Gator in a mud hole, happy but lookin'.
Where's that pretty waitress with the nice buds? She'll have my cola

eyes glowing like fireflies

 

[1234a5678b]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

There's people still happily running x86 computers. It all depends on what a person's needs/wants are.

*We* are enthusiasts, looking to push the envelope, so I don't think we accurately represent the total body of growers, who are probably more than happy if they're meeting their needs, whether large or small, no matter how old their tech is.

I started out a year ago looking to meet my medical needs, but Ed Rosenthal said something to the effect of 'marijuana isn't addicting, but growing it is.'

I guess I now qualify as an addict.

Keep up the great work!

 

[Karr]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

if you ever venture into dwc or similar hydro i would LOVE to see a nute/res change comparison. With units like my rainforest 66 and most DWC buckets and setups a lot of people suggest changing the res every week, some push it to two weeks or just 10 days.

In my mind a res could be kept topped off by measuring the nutrients in the resivoir and adjusting ppm and ph to match. This would be a chemical nutrient system, so no organic organisms (microbes) would be in the resivior. Going chemical nutrients you could then keep the nutrient solution sterilized with the use of h2o2. This would help prevent the negative connotations we often see with stagnant water. Alge would be unlikely(impossible perhaps) and i don't see much else being an issue that the h2o2 could not take care of. With this thought one could simply replenish water/nutrients as it is used and this could cut back on costs quite a bit as almost all the water that is missing is being used(some evap of coarse).
It works in my mind, but in the real world, im sure there is more i haven't thought of. One pitfall i could see is if that you would need to use more specific nutrients as the plants might use more P and as you keep topping off your consistantly adding more nutrients that the plant may not be using while not fully replenishing the needed P or whichever nute at the time.


And i really do believe that in five years a majority of indoor growers will not be using a common hps system of today. I believe led to become a much stronger player as well as CMH. If we can get some horticultural CMH bulbs going, who knows what that will change, though i suppose it could be compared to the mh/hps dual arc bulbs, maybe not. How about sulphur plasma? It could be it and the technology involved is not very complicated so costs should subside. Just some micro wave emitters, a glass bulb on a motor filled with sulphur, some fans.


What can i say really other than im a dreamer. always hoping for that next big revolutuion.

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

progress in grow light technology is exponential, so within our lifetimes, we're no doubt going to have our world's rocked.

Moore's law - Wikipedia

Accelerating change - Wikipedia

It's a very cool time we're living in

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

SS here is a CMH bud for you. The image had to be resized, before you could zoom in on the trichs to an extent. oh well free hosting

hoping to finish soon

that is just beautiful! thanks! makes me want to get started, lol


I should have said that I've never seen CMH bud in person, because this pic of a plant grown by our resident poet, Propa Gator, fanned the flame a while back.

 

[Propa Gator]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

Mr Sun, this is where you got my attention, and I first learned of CMH:

Thanks BigSmokie!

My babies are movin' on up! I bought a Secret Jardin DR80 grow tent and switched from the HPS 150 to a 250 watt ceramic metal halide.

Here's some week 6 pics:

This is just one of many beautiful buds from your new tent & light:

Here's a pic of Dew that I forgot to post:

You just haven't seen PE buds live... yet

 

[go green]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

SS, what size of a pot is charlie brown in? Are those the 4" or 5" pots as seen from some stores, 10 pack.

We use a lot of the same gear.

-Go

 

[go green]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

SS,

I notice you don't top your soil to the brim of your containers. Can you give me your reasoning for such? Curiouser and curiouser...

-Go

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

Hey SS, my question is about after you flipm, do you just leave them tied down? Or do you untie them after a while? This has caught my eye as I think it wil be very helpfull in my application. 420 mag is awesome along with all of the green room vets helping newbs like I!

You can do it either way. It's a very flexible method, and you can modify and apply it according to your needs and headroom.

If you just want your plants to bush out a little more, but not wind up with them shorter than you want, you could untie them after you get the desired branching and then let them go.

As long as they're in veg or even early bloom, you can tie and release as needed to achieve the shape and height you want.

I heard about this option from bmarduk, and he seems to use it to great benefit.

thanks PHD

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

.

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

As my grow comes to an end I sit staring at my buds wondering what could have been if I used the HPS bulb that's been sitting on my desk.

I am really looking forward to your next comparison grow. There's no one else I'd rather see do it.

The more I think about it, the more stoked I get about doing it .

A couple of my objections to CMH seem to have been resolved also, so I'm going to enjoy the grow.

I'm picky about noise, and I've been patiently waiting for CMH bulbs that run on digital ballasts, but that hasn't happened yet except for a few expensive ballasts that I don't want to invest in.

But, when I ran my 250w mag ballast recently, it seemed a lot quieter than what I recalled. It buzzes a little, but it's not too annoying.

either my tolerance is up or my hearing is down

My second objection to CMH, and why I yanked my 250w CMH bulb and replaced it with an HPS halfway through my trial run, was that the UV radiation, which is considerable, was making my skin feel all prickly and sunburned.

I've since learned how to protect my skin with long-sleeved shirts and/or sunblock, and I always wear UV-blocking glasses in my grow room these days, so those habits are already in place.

A ball cap and some kind of light shield, temporary or semi-permanent for the grow, should help keep things safe for my eyes and skin.

very simple and clean setup with really good ventilation efficiency from not having anything but the bulb obstructing the air-flow, which it doesn't to any significant degree.

360-degree direct light, fan blowing cool air straight up at the bulb from below, carbon filter sucking at the top, not much at all in the way, it's a sweet thing.

500+ watts to run both tents is efficient energy-wise also.

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

Vertical light mover, now thats a good idea. Really good idea

very smart!

+1

Silent Bob has lots of good ideas

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

same with me marly, i mean maybe it would be best to veg with cmh, flower for first 2 weeks with cmh, then flip hps for 4 weeks, then finish under cmh. Something to that extent maybe.

ideally i think a 400w cmh along side a 400w hps (or 600) would be pretty tops for smallish grows. rotating the plants or the lights for best variety.

It's possible that using some combination of both bulbs during a grow may be the best option, but I'd like to keep it simple and just compare the isolated performance of one bulb to the other.

Maybe by running the entire cycle with the same bulbs, during the course of the grow we'll get an idea of which bulb is best for which part of the grow cycle if each excels in different areas.

so many questions, so much conjecture, so few like ss.

any clone of mine would completely ignore me, so what's to be done? lol

honestly, I used to wonder why I couldn't find more comparison grows, but not anymore

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

With your photography skills Sun, we will see EXACTLY what CMH can do vs. HPS... I can see the sparkling trichomes now...

Time to break out the 4 cubic foot bag of

The biggest variable for me with vertical grows has been where to hang the bulb in relation to the plants - how far down from the top is optimum?

In the past I've converted a mover to raise and lower the bulb vertically, but I think as long as the top buds get some light, they'll do fine, and it's certainly more efficient to hang the bulb well below the tops of the plants.

I can't wait to see how you address this issue!

Thanks for your interest and encouragement, Silent Bob .

I plan on keeping the setup stump simple, so I won't be using light movers.

As I currently see it, the issue is really no different than trying to find the sweet spot with a horizontal setup, you just have to turn your head sideways, just like when reading Mr. Gator's posts, lol.

There has to be a bulb height relative to the canopy where things are compromised the least and the plants are illuminated most efficiently.

I'm going to try to find where that is, and my IR thermometer is probably going to be helpful in that regard.

I'm sure that it would take more than one grow to dial things in, but maybe we can get some idea of what general height the bulb works best.

 

[Karr]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

I'm 100% behind comparing just those two bulbs start to finish, I think we can learn a lot with stable clones and scientific standards. Your able to pretty much isolate the bulbs as the only variance which means everything else we see is a byproduct of the different bulbs.

Also in regards to the uv comment, I too felt the danger of using CMH lighting. The first day I had it I worked too long under it (only 10 min or so) and got a slight Reaction in my eyes. Since that day I have been much more careful to have my glasses.

I even was inspired to pass my tale along to others, but on the other site your have to be an uncle or a brick to carry any merit.

Keep in mind some CMH bulbs have a built in uv coating that filters out uv, while some bulbs do not. I can't remember how to identify which is which, but it's good to know


Do we have any sort of a t minus for launch?

Haha very excited

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

I started out a year ago looking to meet my medical needs, but Ed Rosenthal said something to the effect of 'marijuana isn't addicting, but growing it is.'

I guess I now qualify as an addict.

Keep up the great work!

thanks bro

as an old southern friend of mine used to say,

"I prefer to think of it as an all-encompassing hobby rather than an addiction"

 

[Setting Sun]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

That's a very well said comment SS.

Wise words are upon us. I am ordering up HPS ballasts to keep my room WARM!

On my end...sometimes we regress to that old technology...as the reliability is usually unparalleled to the newer.

-Go

What's in my best interest, as a grower, is to assess my circumstances, and use whichever tool gets the job done best, not to put all my eggs in a single technology and then try to make it do everything well.

Again, however, if I was only going to have one light, currently it would be an LED, because they perform very well, as evidenced by the GLH Spectra 300 on this grow, and I can use them year-round because heat is easier to manage.

The upcoming 250w HID vertical grow may challenge that, but that's just conjecture at this point.

SS, what size of a pot is charlie brown in? Are those the 4" or 5" pots as seen from some stores, 10 pack.

We use a lot of the same gear.

-Go

That's a 5" square pot, but I'm also using 4" square pots.

SS,

I notice you don't top your soil to the brim of your containers. Can you give me your reasoning for such? Curiouser and curiouser...

-Go

I used to fill my pots all the way to the top, and more than once have reminded beginning growers to use all the root space available to them when I would notice what you just noticed, but these days, more often than not, I wind up putting a layer of hydroton over the soil or whatever, and I like the layer to be at least 1" thick to slow down evaporation, so I don't fill my pots all the way to the top now in anticipation of putting the pebbles in there.

If I wasn't using the hydroton on top, I'd be just as anal as ever about filling them to the brim, lol

thanks Go

 

[Planter]

re: GrowLEDHydro 300W LED vs. 400W HID Demonstration

Hello SS. wondering if u might be able to help me with some of your knowledge!

topic is wet Hay/ fresh tomato smell. how do we get this and what do we need to do to not get it? im just really baffled as to why i am getting this smell. my MF had it. i took a small nug from my kali mist to have as a taster and the same this wet hay/tomato smell. KM is nearly nearly done. and i really dont want this happening to all my kali.
can u help any?
can it be low humidity during the drying?
can it be low himidity during flower, plants life?
can it be innature bud?