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High Stress & Other Training With Defoliation: Starting Indoor, Finishing Outdoor, First Time To Buy Seed, Somewhat A Newbie Cannabis Grower

InTheShed

Member of the Year: 2018 - Member of the Month: Jan 2018, Nov 2018 - Grow Journal of the Month: Aug 2018 - Plant of the Month: Oct 2018
The next plants I start indoor to go outdoor I’m gonna veg them on 16/8 and gradually take them down to 14 or 15hrs of light before I put them outdoor ✌
If you know you're going outdoors in spring you should run the spring sun schedule from seed or clone. Then when it goes outside it's only getting more light until June 21st, never less.

As you have noticed I don’t and won’t talk about my light schedules, watering, soil or where and why I top at certain location which all helps reduce stunting a plant to around a day or two.
Why is that?
Yea the sun penetrates awesome
When it's out! ;)
 

SB4L

Well-Known Member
@InTheShed

24hr for seedlings, after that I go to 18/6.
Then ou might disagree with me but it did great after the last defo. I ran my light equivalent to 18/6 but cut it in half to 9/3.

I don’t think it was due to the light schedule but due to the days that it was storming and my ph on the nutes didn’t help being under 6. It’s my mistake and should of raised the ph and disrupted the night with light.

Which I have a timer on a light outside in the middle of the night for 30 mins and raised my ph but the vitamins seem to have a buffer bc I can’t get it above 6.5.

I waited till may to put outside bc the two years ago I put them outside in March and they did this but flowered way heavier. Next year I’ll just put out in March / April and disrupt the nights for a month or so until they adjust. Idk it’s all experimenting to make a experience to become better on the next
 
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InTheShed

Member of the Year: 2018 - Member of the Month: Jan 2018, Nov 2018 - Grow Journal of the Month: Aug 2018 - Plant of the Month: Oct 2018
Not sure why you wouldn't talk about that. This is a place where we share what we're doing! And face the questions :).

Not sure if your familiar with the Gas Lamp method but it's similar to your lighting schedule where the dark period is interrupted.

I don't know much about controlling flowering with pH like Sphinx, but I do know he was mixing hundreds of gallons of nutes at a time, making it much easier to control what he was feeding . It’s got to be harder working in smaller batches.

So many growers here are experiencing the early flowering thing, with strings of cloudy days or changes going from indoor to outside. I'm curious if an hour of light at 1am would short circuit that on a plant that hadn't started flowering yet.
 

SB4L

Well-Known Member
So my theory to the 9/3 was that younger plants can only absorb so much light a day then need dark to grow. So 18/6 is the most talked about method. From my studying I figured why not let them grow more frequently to the absorption of energy. I actually went from 12hr seedlings to 6/2 to 9/3 and my stressing reduced to only a day of stunning. My soil is miracle grow organic bc it can in smaller bags that I could use as pots and not sink to much money into until I actually knew I what I wanted to do and I’m veggin with miracle as my base nutes. I know I’ll get crushed for this, even if not said aloud. Reason behind it one of my grow buddies said that I couldn’t grow a monster from it. I definitely won’t be flowering with the miracle grow bloom lol. But that’s why i invested in vitamins with the miracle grow nutes to definitely help out what it lacks. That’s why I don’t talk about it, bc it’s miracle grow lol. I guess you could say I would have a even better crop if I started earlier, been able to control the environment inside and use better materials all around the grow. But it was somewhat inexpensive and just reacting to every situation to the best of my knowledge or what I wanted to see happen if I did this.

I did hit the plants with light at the beginning of being outside but didn’t continue which I should have. What the real underlying of why some started flowering and others haven’t is interesting to me. Bc I’ve been doing exactly the same thing to all of them. ***Never mind when I had the light on outside it was low and to the front of the group, the rest was shaded or really didn’t get a high exposure to the light. I see where I went wrong, hopefully it don’t hurt me too much the flowers are tiny. It could actually help as acting as a supper crop and explode since I will be up-potting soon. Just depends on how everything goes and I can compare to the ones that didn’t flower to the ones that have.

Also I will be mixing nutes in a 300 gallon water tote with a bubblers once I up-pot. The reason I mix in gallon jugs right now is just feasible due to the size of the pots / plants.

I also just read the gas lantern routine and I have to agree with my thoughts at the beginning of this grow. I can see where it helps bc your plants do most of their growing at night and only absorb light for energy to grow at night. (Maybe why my cfls did so well to create a short and strong plant at the beginning, wonder what it would be like from a better / stronger producing light.) That’s why outdoor plants grow so huge is bc of the nights being so long then when the plant is huge it can produce so much energy from the massive light bulb god created and get even bigger.

Everyone always seems to flow the same patterns as everyone else and I’m just doing from what I learnt. This year I’ve been filled with a ton of knowledge I wish I knew from the beginning. But that’s why next year will be better and will have to have some different controls going to see the best results, rather than doing basically the same to all. Like a control with 3x3 test/strain = 9 plants +1 (plant identical the same as this year) of each strain. 3 plants to each 3 different indoor light set ups, with 3 different nutes types. I could play with the light schedule with my clones now to see the better results and drawl a conclusion there.
 

InTheShed

Member of the Year: 2018 - Member of the Month: Jan 2018, Nov 2018 - Grow Journal of the Month: Aug 2018 - Plant of the Month: Oct 2018

SB4L

Well-Known Member
Plans are put a drip system in with 4 emitters in each corners of bed and water strictly at night to morning times. Will be covering beds with lawyers of straw / hay to reduce bed / pot temps. They will be raised off the ground up to 4 inches so they will get airflow underneath. But still want to nute by hand.

Yes, that’s why clones can go under 24hrs of light. So there are plenty of studies on light schedules already. But the benefits from 24hr lights on show to not maximize growth that’s why the 18/6 is the thought of most common. 14/10 is said to produce a higher root growth. And you have to have 12/12 to flower a normal plant. So looking at a bunch of numbers and thinking of our humans life, we can survive going 24hrs with no sleep but start preforming poorly with no rest. So leaves are light solar panels and the batteries can only hold so much before the light then is wasted while it put a hold on charging and more pressure to add batteries at a higher temp. Only so much nutes can be added at one time for absorption before the plants start burning, kinda like when humans eat they add fat and get lazy then harder to transition into muscle or if you don’t eat enough you get the point. I like using the example it helps some start thinking outside the box and I can continue from working out / training ext.

So why would plants double in size going from the norm of 18/6 to 12/12 and stretch and grow so fast doubling it size and still able to produce buds as well. It’s from a health well balance schedule of lights, water, nutes and most importantly rest.

My thoughts is why does it preform so well with the 12/12 rather than why a plant is not increasing growth as much at 18/6 and from my little studies show that making shorter quicker days help with stunning and the health of the plant that there are better methods than what the norm is producing. Sometimes more isn’t better, like quality is better over quantity. But what if this also implies to the whole plants life rather than just bud talk and it can start producing quantity quality buds just by not over doing some things. Giving things more frequently than trying to packing it on all at once.

I hope that’s clearly wrote, its way to early in the am and I’m not proofreading as most don’t like reading the longer post.
 

InTheShed

Member of the Year: 2018 - Member of the Month: Jan 2018, Nov 2018 - Grow Journal of the Month: Aug 2018 - Plant of the Month: Oct 2018
So there are plenty of studies on light schedules already. But the benefits from 24hr lights on show to not maximize growth
That's not in the studies I've seen.

"One way in which plants are categorized is by the way they gather and handle carbon dioxide. Cannabis is a C3 plant. It uses the CO2 it gathers during the light period, when it is photosynthesizing. Plants designated C4 also gather CO2 during the dark period for use during the light period. Many C3 plants, including cannabis, do not need a rest period. They continue to photosynthesize as long as they are receiving light.

The plant’s photosynthetic rate determines its growth rate because the sugars are used by the plant to build tissue and for energy. Cannabis under continuous light will grow 33% faster than the same plants on an 18-6 light regime."


and the following information is straight from Greg Green's "The Cannabis Grow Bible"

"Cannabis is a light demanding plant. Professional growers keep the light on their plants using the 24/0 photoperiod for this reason. Plants that grow under 24/0 flourish and do not need a quantity of darkness in order to rest and perform photosynthesis properly. Plants that are grown in optimal conditions under 24/0 light regime grow vigorusly and the benefits of a 24/0 photoperiod can be seen actively in the results. More nodes are formed, more branches are created, leaf numbers increase, the plant is growing at its finest."

C3 plants will grow continuously during a 24/0 cycle, and while it's not good for the electric bill, it does produce larger plants.
 

SB4L

Well-Known Member
So without having to go in so much explanation, then why do most commercial growers not run the 24/0 veg then and run a dark cycle. Let’s eliminate the excuses of heat bc there are plenty of light efficient without producing heat. If it grows so vigorously then cost wouldn’t be a factor either bc the plant would hit the desired size quicker, eliminating time and producing more. But you continuously here about the good effects even if it’s not mentioned of a dark cycle or people implying it to the veg grow.

I agree that cannabis don’t need dark to survive. I guess if you don’t agree that the dark cycle is a important role for the plant in the veg stage then we can agree to disagree.
 

InTheShed

Member of the Year: 2018 - Member of the Month: Jan 2018, Nov 2018 - Grow Journal of the Month: Aug 2018 - Plant of the Month: Oct 2018
The dark cycle is scientifically unnecessary for cannabis plants to thrive, and they grow bigger with 24 hours of light. Commercial growers surely do a cost/benefit analysis on additional plant growth vs. the number one cost to running their grow...the electric bill for lighting and climate.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, nor am I in any way telling you how to grow, but the science is clear.
 
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SB4L

Well-Known Member
Lol, if they grow bigger with 24/0 then it should offset the cost of their grow bc then they would be harvesting more frequently with bigger plants or sooner bc the plant has reached it desired size. Ac is ran continuously anyways bc lower outputs to maintain the desired temp is ego friendly. It cost more to start them up than to just slowly let it do its things.

So why is it said you get a better stretching at night?

Well on another note I got one whw hermi lol. Atleast it’s only one and now it time to just put it inside and flower by itself to get some hash or just throw it away and cut my losses. If I had other matured plants inside it definitely would just been cut immediately.
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No worries not stressing over one, now just got to see how they do with the reverting back and going forward, hopefully no more hermis will appear later but have to factor in a possibility. The rest look good and still see growth for my day pics even with a cloudy day which doesn’t help in reveggin the ones that need it but we shall see, still a long time to go.
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InTheShed

Member of the Year: 2018 - Member of the Month: Jan 2018, Nov 2018 - Grow Journal of the Month: Aug 2018 - Plant of the Month: Oct 2018
If it was going to hermie anyway, it's kind of a good thing that they went into flower early and let you know. If it hermied because it went into flower early, you probably don't want to keep that plant's clones alive if it has a tendency to stress herm. Either way, one plant won't keep you from hitting your goal!
 

SB4L

Well-Known Member
Well I got one good day of work on the beds and man they sure do look nice when I get completely done with them I’ll put up pics. Same goes for the indoor grow, everything seems to be get push later an later but it will get done.

Here are some pics of the girls from ever direction and a few random top pics. Some have revegged and I’ve only seen a few signs from others but nothing drastic.

Regular whole top view
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west view
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north view
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South view
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I’ll post the rest below
 
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