Increasing yield with defoliation indoors: What's it mean? How to do it?

[Bassman59]

Silverrockstarr, show us some pics 7-10 days after and it should be pretty impressive.

Fault, since we really dont know for sure on the timing it's hard to say. My plants begin to flower within 5 days of flipping. So you can see where I'm unsure of your timing. Hitting them during stretch is always going to slow them because the plant is in "stretch mode" far more than flower mode.

 

[fault]

So is this going to decrease my yield?

 

[noobkinda]

Nice

 

[donpaul.p]

stretch time can vary depending on how mature the plant is, if the plant is fully mature during veg then it can flower within a week of flipping 12-12, mature plants show sex even under a veg schedule

when i use 18-6 or 17-7 for veg my plants usually show sex around week 6 onwards and no more than week 8,
when i grew under 24-0 it took much longer and most did not show sex at all until i flipped 12-12.

you also get more stretch when going from 24-0 to 12-12 then you do going from 18-6 to 12-12.

the reason plants stretch when you flip 12-12 is because the plant is trying to find the light again, then once its started flowering or got used to the light schedule which is around day 21 of 12-12 then it stops stretching,

plants do at least 3 things during the lights out period, they repair damage done during the lights on period, the send nutrients and energy back down to the roots and this helps with root development which is why 18-6 was proven to produce the best root growth during veg, the other process they do during night time is stretch, their doing this to try and find the light, just like the lower branches do if their not getting light or if you have a plant thats shaded then it will start to stretch so it finds the light again.

things that i know from my own experience that stunt the stretch phase is over watering, when i first started growing i over watered and my plants just wouldnt grow and did very little growing during the stretch phase

 

[silverrocksta]

Hey guys, here are the girls at day 30 flower and nine days after the day 21 Defole the 5g bucket is oh God bud and the other three are silver rockstar skunk

.

 

[TheCapn]

Bass, I finally had a chance to go thru this article again. I have been experimenting with defoliation. I think there is something that has to do with abusing plants during vegetative growth. It delays them, but somehow the abuse makes the stronger.

Is this the theory? The plants sense the abuse and then come back stronger? My highest yielding plant nearly died in veg because the spaghetti line got disconnected when I was out of town. I literally threw it in the trash and then got it back out again. It came back to produce an astounding yield.

Or is the theory based simply on light penetration? Or both?

 

[Bassman59]

Light is the big thing Cap'n. For those of us with limited space/plant numbers/height, it's all about light penetration. I'm sure you've seen tons of plants that 6-8" below the canopy it's totally dark. Our goal is to eliminate as much of that as possible.

During veg this also promotes more & tighter internodal growth. And like you, we bend the hell out of them laterally to open them up and get side branches going up.

 

[matrixfree]

Bassman - could I get your opinion/advice? This is my first grow - I have two plants that I have just been letting grow and only providing good nutes, light, etc. They are in soil in 15 gallon smart pots growing under 1000w Hortilux Super HPS with a Raptor Reflector Hood. Hood is air cooled and stays very cool, so I'm able to keep about 14" from the tops. The plants are very healthy and growing vigorously and are both about 28" tall. I'm exactly 5 weeks into veg. One is Northern Lights Big Bud and the other is Afghan Kush. Is it too late in your opinion to aggressively defoliate? Pics attached. Thanks so much!

 

[Bassman59]

Maxi, a couple thoughts for you.

1, At 28" tall already and 2x stretch at least (I don't know how much NL or A.K. stretches) Your plants will end in the 56-60" range. But the light will only deliver good light 36" deep. With good cooling you could feasibly lower the light another 4-5" and get more penetration. The light and tallness of the plants is extremely important.

2. If you defoliate now, you'll want to wait at least 1 week before flipping to flower for full recovery.

3. If it were me, I would take clones from the tops. Nice big clones because they are so tall. Then I would bend the hell out of them laterally. Bending to get them much lower and tons wider. Your hood covers a nice large area. Same hood I use. So I would bend the hell out of them then defoliate the shit out of them too. In a week, after they've bushed back up I would flip them to flower immediately.

4. My goal is to have my plants end up at around 34" tall or so. Though I almost always end up too tall, I also bend the hell out of them during stretch period and early flower to keep them shorter. I need to do a better job myself training them laterally more in earliest veg and defoliating them sooner in early veg too. This would keep them at proper height for the light.

Hope this helps! Best wishes on your 1st grow. That being said, it's often better to get your growing down pretty pat before using these more advanced techniques. Makes it much easier as you wont have other issues coming in to play.

 

[BigIrishDoode]

Bass quick question,I'm building an ebb & flow for yet another attempt at hydro this time I'm going fully live and organic with the sns nutes,and massive myko population do you think your methods would apply to an organic ebb & flow hydro, it was a disaster in organic soil,and I've noticed most successful hi defol growing is hydro,I don't know of it working in soil, mixed results in Coco,but organic ebb & flow hydro has me wondering, this would be after a successful run to see if it works like I'm hoping,any thoughts much appreo!

 

[matrixfree]

Maxi, a couple thoughts for you.

1, At 28" tall already and 2x stretch at least (I don't know how much NL or A.K. stretches) Your plants will end in the 56-60" range. But the light will only deliver good light 36" deep. With good cooling you could feasibly lower the light another 4-5" and get more penetration. The light and tallness of the plants is extremely important.

2. If you defoliate now, you'll want to wait at least 1 week before flipping to flower for full recovery.

3. If it were me, I would take clones from the tops. Nice big clones because they are so tall. Then I would bend the hell out of them laterally. Bending to get them much lower and tons wider. Your hood covers a nice large area. Same hood I use. So I would bend the hell out of them then defoliate the shit out of them too. In a week, after they've bushed back up I would flip them to flower immediately.

4. My goal is to have my plants end up at around 34" tall or so. Though I almost always end up too tall, I also bend the hell out of them during stretch period and early flower to keep them shorter. I need to do a better job myself training them laterally more in earliest veg and defoliating them sooner in early veg too. This would keep them at proper height for the light.

Hope this helps! Best wishes on your 1st grow. That being said, it's often better to get your growing down pretty pat before using these more advanced techniques. Makes it much easier as you wont have other issues coming in to play.

Awesome! Thanks brother! Much appreciated

 

[Bassman59]

Bid, Soil or hydro doesnt matter from what I have seen. I know one soil guy running vert lighting that was avging 10.4z per plant and did this and avg'd 15.4 iirc.

It's about timing too. Nutes wont matter. Have your plants down pat. I wouldnt do it with a lot of different strains at once unless they were extremely close in characteristics.

 

[Bassman59]

Awesome! Thanks brother! Much appreciated

BTW Welcome to 420mag! I'm honored to have your first posts here.

 

[BigIrishDoode]

Ok cool, I just was under the impression that since soil plants grow slower and don't seen to form those big knuckles when they are healing and repair time is longer that it was more of a hydro application, but we'll see I'm thinking I'll run my blue dream in the ebb first

 

[Hiker]

I think the growing method has less of an impact than the strain. Some strains respond well to manipulation. Some don't.

I'm glad you're trying a flood & drain system. It is my favorite flavor of hydro. Someday I'll try a dwc, maybe, but they just seem more tenuous. I really like the RDWC style, like Ronnie's, but that's a more advanced hydro system. I'd like to build one of my own somday, with a few tweaks of course!

And yes, the benefits of this system are both increased penetration and to stress the plant in order to get a response, ie increased branching.

 

[s1ingblade]

High There Bassman
Wanted to stop by and personally invite you and your subscribers to my new journal
4000 Watt Top-Feed Rec Grow Cubes Cap'n Style OG Kush
Hope to see you all there

 

[yttocs1010]

whats the purpose of the ropes or netting if you will please explain

 

[Bassman59]

whats the purpose of the ropes or netting if you will please explain

Buds get too heavy for the branches. Also bending laterally and giving support until a hard knuckle forms. Basically it's to position flowers/branches where you want them and even out the top into a more even canopy for equal, good, lighting.

 

[yttocs1010]

woke up this morning and was going to attempt it just couldnt tho next grow

 

[progressive13]

just defoliated 21 days into flowering, lets see if the buds swell up!