Opinions wanted on green light in flowering room after lights out

[Curly Beaver]

I have a decent quality headband/headlamp that has clear, red and green lights. If an occasion pops up where I need to get into the flowering area after lights out I put it on and keep the lights out. I have seen green light bulbs, and got to wondering if they would work too. Has anybody used them? Do they keep plants from going hermie? If they do work, any particular brand or specifics I should consider?
Thanks

 

[smokiebear]

This thread is a pretty good place to start. However, that's all the experience I have on the subject. I will say that due to my own paranoid nature, I probably wouldn't go in during lights out unless it was an emergency. I'm not that brave yet

 

[Onkruid]

Great question. The green will serve best as for all intents and purposes it's in a benign area of the spectrum. To your plants it's just about non existent. Red on the other hand, although excellent for human vision night-adaptation, is a poor choice for your plants as it's is a major component of the plants' functional spectrum requirements and will thus be noticed by them, which in turn could cause unwanted dark period interruption.

Practical example: I've used a green headlamp for years with no problems.

 

[TanR]

Hi BeaverIslander,

I'd like to respond to your question with a potentially provacative statement. I think the whole "even a little light will hermie your plants" thing is wrong. Realize a bunch of folks will suggest they've had or seen it happen or know some story about it, or read in a this or that book, but I suggest the attributions of light exposure causing stress/hermie's is a case of correlation without causation. That is to say that yes, the plants did hermie and perhaps there was a light leak or light within the tent, but haven't seen proof it was caused by said light.

Common sense tells me cannabis grown outdoors is exposed to incidental light from a variety of sources. The moon for one. I've seen nights (and so has eveyone else) where the moon was bright enough to walk safely in an unfamiliar area without additional lighting. I've read the whole "but the moon isn't bright enough to..." argument to which I suggest that it's a heck of lot more light than the power button on the LED light hanging in there, to which I've seen some attribute as the cause of plants hermi'ing. I've seen people suggest it was a computer power button or monitor all the way across the room! And yet think of all the plants growing outdoors that are exposed to streetlights or patio lighting from their own or neighbors yards. I don't hear stories of how those lights caused someones plant to hermie.

I personnally do not require complete stealth. I use a tent, but rarely zip it up. Day or night. I've gone into my grow area many times during lights out and have turned on lights in the room to move around safely. We have two computers in the same room, one of which my wife regularly leaves on (monitor too) and I've yet to have a plant hermie - ever.

One cycle, I was fighting heat issues and flipped the lights on/lights off schedule completely so lights on would be exactly when they previously had been lights out. No hermie. Burned out a timer in the middle of a grow once and light stayed on 24 hours before I was aware. No hermie.

I realize I'm too am using antecdotal (correlation/causation) evidence to back up my suggestion or explain my thinking but it's difficult to prove a negative or the absence of something and suggest we temper some of the stuff we've read or learned, with a little common sense and experience.

Off my soapbox now. Thanks for humoring me.

Be well and happy growing!

 

[Onkruid]

^Excellent post.

 

[Emilya Green]

while it is true that the plants can barely notice a green light, I have to ask why would you want to be in there working on the plants during their rest time? Since you are god/goddess of the lights, why not put the daylight part of the schedule, at least in part, in a time of your day that allows you to get in there? What would you be doing in there in the dark anyway, trimming? They would surely notice that. Watering? The best time to water is at sunrise. Maybe like me you just like sitting with the plants, but are afraid of the dark? May I suggest aversion therapy, first using the green light all the time, and then getting used to more and more of the dark? lol Just kidding... but seriously, I have one of those nifty green cfl's if I need it, but I never use it.

 

[Onkruid]

In my instance it's all about appreciation. While the occurrences of 'midnight viewing' have waned over the years, in no way have I become immune to their fluorescing and night beauty. It's a matter of being able to appreciate subtleties not seen under the harshness and intensity of our version of daylight. Not just the relaxing of their posture, but more-so early trich formation and progression. Wouldn't dare interfere with them otherwise. Love'em too much for that.

 

[Weaselcracker]

I've used a green led light for the last six years now with no discernible negative effects whatsoever. My grow is a semi-automated seat of the pants affair which I'm almost always away from. I often rocket through during lights out and have to check on them, water, feed, drag plants out for trimming, bring trimmed buds back in to the dryer box, etc etc. It's not ideal, but the plants seem completely fine.
On the other hand, almost every hermie outbreak I've had corresponded perfectly to light leaks. The red indicator lights on devices seem to be plenty enough to do it for some strains. Other times it was an unsealed crack in the door, whatever. Once I fixed the light leak the hermies would stop.
I suspect if a plant flowers in a room with a small light leak that is totally consistent, it probably won't care. But unexpected light interruptions and fluctuations (too many timer screwups) can be a killer.

 

[Curly Beaver]

while it is true that the plants can barely notice a green light, I have to ask why would you want to be in there working on the plants during their rest time? Since you are god/goddess of the lights, why not put the daylight part of the schedule, at least in part, in a time of your day that allows you to get in there? What would you be doing in there in the dark anyway, trimming? They would surely notice that. Watering? The best time to water is at sunrise. Maybe like me you just like sitting with the plants, but are afraid of the dark? May I suggest aversion therapy, first using the green light all the time, and then getting used to more and more of the dark? lol Just kidding... but seriously, I have one of those nifty green cfl's if I need it, but I never use it.

The only time I feel the need to get in there is when I have one in flowering that I think is "almost ready" to be whacked. Been told that even a couple of minutes of light before the dirty deed is enough to get everything moving up from the roots again so if I can clip a couple samples and take them to a lit room to examine it seems like it oughta save 24 hours. Other than that... I don't go in there. Anyway, thats my story

Edited to add... when I did this at 5am yesterday morning I found enough amber on a Grand Daddy Purple clone to pull it before the lights came on. She's in the dark now, thought I'd try your 48 hour of darkness before cutting trick, see if I can tell any difference.

 

[Curly Beaver]

I've used a green led light for the last six years now with no discernible negative effects whatsoever. My grow is a semi-automated seat of the pants affair which I'm almost always away from. I often rocket through during lights out and have to check on them, water, feed, drag plants out for trimming, bring trimmed buds back in to the dryer box, etc etc. It's not ideal, but the plants seem completely fine.
On the other hand, almost every hermie outbreak I've had corresponded perfectly to light leaks. The red indicator lights on devices seem to be plenty enough to do it for some strains. Other times it was an unsealed crack in the door, whatever. Once I fixed the light leak the hermies would stop.
I suspect if a plant flowers in a room with a small light leak that is totally consistent, it probably won't care. But unexpected light interruptions and fluctuations (too many timer screwups) can be a killer.

What type of green light do you use?

 

[Curly Beaver]

Hi BeaverIslander,

I'd like to respond to your question with a potentially provacative statement. I think the whole "even a little light will hermie your plants" thing is wrong. Realize a bunch of folks will suggest they've had or seen it happen or know some story about it, or read in a this or that book, but I suggest the attributions of light exposure causing stress/hermie's is a case of correlation without causation. That is to say that yes, the plants did hermie and perhaps there was a light leak or light within the tent, but haven't seen proof it was caused by said light.

Common sense tells me cannabis grown outdoors is exposed to incidental light from a variety of sources. The moon for one. I've seen nights (and so has eveyone else) where the moon was bright enough to walk safely in an unfamiliar area without additional lighting. I've read the whole "but the moon isn't bright enough to..." argument to which I suggest that it's a heck of lot more light than the power button on the LED light hanging in there, to which I've seen some attribute as the cause of plants hermi'ing. I've seen people suggest it was a computer power button or monitor all the way across the room! And yet think of all the plants growing outdoors that are exposed to streetlights or patio lighting from their own or neighbors yards. I don't hear stories of how those lights caused someones plant to hermie.

I personnally do not require complete stealth. I use a tent, but rarely zip it up. Day or night. I've gone into my grow area many times during lights out and have turned on lights in the room to move around safely. We have two computers in the same room, one of which my wife regularly leaves on (monitor too) and I've yet to have a plant hermie - ever.

One cycle, I was fighting heat issues and flipped the lights on/lights off schedule completely so lights on would be exactly when they previously had been lights out. No hermie. Burned out a timer in the middle of a grow once and light stayed on 24 hours before I was aware. No hermie.

I realize I'm too am using antecdotal (correlation/causation) evidence to back up my suggestion or explain my thinking but it's difficult to prove a negative or the absence of something and suggest we temper some of the stuff we've read or learned, with a little common sense and experience.

Off my soapbox now. Thanks for humoring me.

Be well and happy growing!

Right-O.
When I started reading I figured out rather quickly that there were more that one train of thought on the subject. I know I have had enough screw ups that if were was 100% fact I should have had hermies by now. Where I live we constantly loose power from 2 minutes to 2 hours at a time. I din't know whether I was just lucky or the plants weren't quite so picky after all. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Weaselcracker]

It's a green led headlamp I bought from a grow supply place. I forget the name but it's something to do with plants, obviously designed, or at least labelled for this purpose. Before that I used a green led flashlight. The headlamp makes things much easier, obviously.

Edit- I get frequent power outages too. They don't seem to cause me trouble for some reason. Having the timer get stuck 'on' and stay that way, has. Or maybe it was the change right back to 12/12 after that screwed things up. But really, light leaks and those red indicator lights have been by far the most common cause for me for hermies (nanners).

 

[Curly Beaver]

It's a green led headlamp I bought from a grow supply place. I forget the name but it's something to do with plants, obviously designed, or at least labelled for this purpose. Before that I used a green led flashlight. The headlamp makes things much easier, obviously.

That sounds like what I have, I think it is a Gerber??? It was a military one with a bigger white light and smaller red and green lamps. It is surprising how much I use it.

 

[ShiggityFlip]

As with many other things it is not an equal situation to compare indoor and outdoor light leaks. Moonlight has quite a bit of far red light (700nm+). Far red light keeps photochrome shifted towards pr which activates flowering response. Our LED grow lights or fluorescent bulbs are more shifted to a growing spectrum (500-700nm). So light leaks in nature are very different. I remember giving advice to a grower who had herm issues with his outdoor plant. We eventually traced it to his kitchen lighting as the grow was close enough to the house.

Episodal light leaks can be an issue indoors and can cause problems. If they haven't then consider yourself blessed! But yes a green light shouldn't be too much of an issue for emergencies, as far as we know it is outside the wavelengths that govern flowering. Still I like to avoid tempting fate. We don't know enough about light spectrum and its effects on plant quality. These types of tests are just being started right now. Some growers are now lighting 24 hours by using spectrums that don't affect the flowering response.
My aim will be to get some far red lights to turn on for the beginning of the darkness cycle and trigger Pfr to revert to Pr more quickly, just like the effects of sunset in nature. It will hopefully shorten the two hour adjustment in total darkness to about 15 minutes with the far red.

 

[TanR]

Thanks for the insight Shig. Yes, I've read a bit about the various wave lengths of light and their assumed effect on cannabis based on effects on other vegatative matter. However, as you rightly point out there is still a lot to be learned specific to cannabis.

In retrospect, I probably should not have started my response by stating the long held light theory was wrong, but instead "worth questioning", if no other reason than all the "evidence" is so anecdotal or circumstantial. The example you cite above about the outdoor grower's hermie/kitchen lighting issues can be countered tit for tat with stories of other outdoor growers that don't experience the same results, and those stories countered with others that do. Until the research is conclusive, it remains open to questioning. I had no intention of suggesting anyone behave recklessly with their girls.

God bless (and I mean that sincerely) all the growers, indoor and out, that have come before us and shared what they learned about growing this plant we all cherish. Many are/were truely heroes and patriots in my eyes. But I confess that I sometimes consider that a lot of the information we take as factual might be better if filtered through a lens of a more empirical nature.

I say this tongue in cheek, hoping others will see humor; But "a lot of the facts as we know them, did come from a bunch of stoners after all".

 

[ShiggityFlip]

Well said! I know there are practices I still had from the days before the internet that were hard to break but when faced with evidence and self trial I had to admit I had just kept doing them purely out of habit. Often we think something makes a difference when it is just another factor such as temperature that is truly responsible. A nutrient related stress could have been the factor which caused a bit of sex reversal, or just the genetics of the strain. I think minor light infractions really don't add up to much. But a constant fairly bright event will be likely to cause a bit of hermie or revegging issue. I haven't seen enough true controlled experiments and am basing that on my anecdotal experience. It is one experiment I don't think I will run lol.

 

[Psydcho]

Question.. I germinated 2 seeds both autos one germinated quickly and I put in soil a week ago. Have my timer set to18-6.. got home last night and I was ready to give up on other seed that had been in wet paper towel for a week.. I was surprised to find it had sprouted. So I decided to put in soil. Seed 1 still had not reached the surface so today during off cycle I wanted to spray the soil to keep damp before I left the house. I was shocked to see that seed one had made it out of soil. I was freaking out because I interrupted the night cycle not knowing it had moved beyond soil. Will this effect anything with it being autos?

 

[Weaselcracker]

It seems to me, something that has gone almost unmentioned, that one of the main influences on hermaphroditism is genetics. This gives you everything from plants that go full blown hermie in late veg or early flowering, to plants that always pop out a few nanners late in flowering, to plants that hermie under varying amounts of stress, to plants that won't hermie even under very stressful conditions. Plants vary a lot in their sensitivity to stress. It's not a black and white situation.
I'm a big fan of testing out theories that don't seem to have much backup. I get excited whenever I see an opportunity to go myth busting. Also a big fan of observation and practical experience though. Kind of the same thing I guess- my whole life is a kind of long term experiment...
I'll take real life experience over some grad students 'scientific' theories any time, no matter how much I hear that real life experience is unscientific.

 

[Weaselcracker]

Question.. I germinated 2 seeds both autos one germinated quickly and I put in soil a week ago. Have my timer set to18-6.. got home last night and I was ready to give up on other seed that had been in wet paper towel for a week.. I was surprised to find it had sprouted. So I decided to put in soil. Seed 1 still had not reached the surface so today during off cycle I wanted to spray the soil to keep damp before I left the house. I was shocked to see that seed one had made it out of soil. I was freaking out because I interrupted the night cycle not knowing it had moved beyond soil. Will this effect anything with it being autos?

Absolutely not.

 

[Curly Beaver]

It seems to me, something that has gone almost unmentioned, that one of the main influences on hermaphroditism is genetics. This gives you everything from plants that go full blown hermie in late veg or early flowering, to plants that always pop out a few nanners late in flowering, to plants that hermie under varying amounts of stress, to plants that won't hermie even under very stressful conditions. Plants vary a lot in their sensitivity to stress. It's not a black and white situation.
I'm a big fan of testing out theories that don't seem to have much backup. I get excited whenever I see an opportunity to go myth busting. Also a big fan of observation and practical experience though. Kind of the same thing I guess- my whole life is a kind of long term experiment...
I'll take real life experience over some grad students 'scientific' theories any time, no matter how much I hear that real life experience is unscientific.

Thanks to everyone that has responded to my question. I considered getting a green screw in bulb but I think I'll stick with the headlamp. No problems so far... why push my luck?

I have some new strains on the way right now so here's hoping their not prone.
New strains plus my first OUTDOOR grow should give me plenty of chances to see my first hermie though, and once again, it'll probably boil down to lighting as I'll need to transition 10 & 12 week old indoor plants to the outdoor sunshine in late May. I think the charts say it should be about 15 hours sunrise to sunset. Should I try to gradually cut my 18/6 down to 15/9 before that time, and just assume they'll start flowering?



Thanks again.