I'd love help dialling in! Sealed room CO2 enriched!

[noydb07]

I've been growing for about 12 years at this point. I have learned , relearned, unlearned. I have grown DWC , Hempy, soil, soiless. Most of my time growing was in some type of soiless (sunshine mix #4, HPCC, HPCC+). I like other growers have experienced growing woes. At times I'm able to grow 2.5 lbs per light and other grows only 1 per light. As of late I've been doing very well and I've been trying to double down with progress and information. In the past I dabbled with co2 enrichment in an unsealed grow space to varying success. Nowadays I'm in a fully sealed environment. I've also used several nutrient lines available on the market , again with varying sucess. I am here to share details, and discuss my personal questions about my set up. I'm open to any and all input! Here we go !
-LIGHT- Next Light Mega (one new series Mega Pro, and one traditional Mega)
-MEDIUM- HPCC+
-NUTRIENT- Remo nutrient line,GH silica additive, terminator, GH ph-up , GH ph-down
-H2O- Reverse osmosis
3 gallon plastic pots + trays
CO2 enrichment is in the form of tank and regulator and is set to 1500ppm
Umol/m²/s - 600-1250 (bottom of canopy to top)
Current room temp high and low are 85⁰high 69⁰low
RELATIVE humidity levels 69⁰high 50⁰low
Recently I started drain to waste for the cleanest end result (that's the hope anyway!)
I have the ability to check ph, ppm, EC, and moisture leves in the root zone.
Here is some of my previous work in an unsealed environment

Strain is Triplescoop Gelato bagseed turned my Flagship!

 

[noydb07]

I suppose if I had a starter question to get it all going, I'd ask if this VPD chart for flower would be accurate at elevated levels of CO2?

 

[CaptainLucky]

I've been growing for about 12 years at this point. I have learned , relearned, unlearned. I have grown DWC , Hempy, soil, soiless. Most of my time growing was in some type of soiless (sunshine mix #4, HPCC, HPCC+). I like other growers have experienced growing woes. At times I'm able to grow 2.5 lbs per light and other grows only 1 per light. As of late I've been doing very well and I've been trying to double down with progress and information. In the past I dabbled with co2 enrichment in an unsealed grow space to varying success. Nowadays I'm in a fully sealed environment. I've also used several nutrient lines available on the market , again with varying sucess. I am here to share details, and discuss my personal questions about my set up. I'm open to any and all input! Here we go !
-LIGHT- Next Light Mega (one new series Mega Pro, and one traditional Mega)
-MEDIUM- HPCC+
-NUTRIENT- Remo nutrient line,GH silica additive, terminator, GH ph-up , GH ph-down
-H2O- Reverse osmosis
3 gallon plastic pots + trays
CO2 enrichment is in the form of tank and regulator and is set to 1500ppm
Umol/m²/s - 600-1250 (bottom of canopy to top)
Current room temp high and low are 85⁰high 69⁰low
RELATIVE humidity levels 69⁰high 50⁰low
Recently I started drain to waste for the cleanest end result (that's the hope anyway!)
I have the ability to check ph, ppm, EC, and moisture leves in the root zone.
Here is some of my previous work in an unsealed environment

Strain is Triplescoop Gelato bagseed turned my Flagship!

Welcome to the @420 Magazine family. Sorry but I’ve never grown with CO2. CL

 

[West Hippie]

I’ve tried CO2 it’s okay . Here is where you want to go Auggie has a thread for questions.
Beautiful Grow

 

[StoneOtter]

NIce growing! Good luck in your quest!

 

[Tokin Roll]

Welcome back to 420 Magazine @noydb07

Tasty looking lady you have there.
I also, do not use CO2, so no help here.

Stay safe, and grow well my friend,
Tok..

 

[Keffka]

I suppose if I had a starter question to get it all going, I'd ask if this VPD chart for flower would be accurate at elevated levels of CO2?

Yes and no.. Higher VPD will allow for greater CO2 intake, increasing photosynthesis but there’s a curve as always. VPD and CO2 can act in concert though and drive up all sorts of efficiencies. It’s worth playing around with as their are impressive photosynthetic and water efficiency gains to be had if you can find a sweet balance.

Here’s a study on the two and their relationship:

Coordination between vapor pressure deficit and CO2 on the regulation of photosynthesis and productivity in greenhouse tomato production - Scientific Reports

The high vapor pressure deficit (VPD) in some arid and semi-arid climates creates undesirable conditions for the growth of tomato plants (Solanum lycopersicum L., cv. Jinpeng). The global CO2 concentration ([CO2]) has also risen in recent years to levels above 400 μmol·mol−1. However, the...

www.nature.com

 

[noydb07]

Yes and no.. Higher VPD will allow for greater CO2 intake, increasing photosynthesis but there’s a curve as always. VPD and CO2 can act in concert though and drive up all sorts of efficiencies. It’s worth playing around with as their are impressive photosynthetic and water efficiency gains to be had if you can find a sweet balance.

Here’s a study on the two and their relationship:

Coordination between vapor pressure deficit and CO2 on the regulation of photosynthesis and productivity in greenhouse tomato production - Scientific Reports

The high vapor pressure deficit (VPD) in some arid and semi-arid climates creates undesirable conditions for the growth of tomato plants (Solanum lycopersicum L., cv. Jinpeng). The global CO2 concentration ([CO2]) has also risen in recent years to levels above 400 μmol·mol−1. However, the...

www.nature.com

This was the exact response I was after! I appreciate this a ton. I believe after reading this I'll be shooting for LowVPD HighCo2 environment! I'll admit it will take me reading this over 5x until I soak it up. But I'm going to try! Thank you

 

[The Twisted One]

I too use c02 in both flower and veg rooms. Even in our veg room, without maintaining the c02, the plants will exhaust the levels way below atmospheric levels. Specifically , I maintain only 600 ppm in the the veg/mother room. I maintain 1100 ppm during lights on in flower.

As far as when in flower, your already pretty close to dialed in, a little overkill in my humble opinion. This said, your right on with your room temps. Many who supplement their rooms with c02 don’t allow the room to get warm enough to take advantage of the expanded stomas that an over 80 degrees room brings into the mix, allowing to plant to uptake those well above atmospheric levels of c02. I grow in temp controlled hydroponics, so no matter what temps the canopy experience, my root zones never fluctuate more than a degree of the 68 degree set point. Indoor soil growers can experience root zone issues when the root temps get close to those room temps.
in closing, your buds are buds I’d be proud of, and I’m known to be a tad anal in this dept. Congrats!

 

[Keffka]

This was the exact response I was after! I appreciate this a ton. I believe after reading this I'll be shooting for LowVPD HighCo2 environment! I'll admit it will take me reading this over 5x until I soak it up. But I'm going to try! Thank you

I missed your response, my bad. I would love an update on this and what you’ve observed happening once you’ve got some results you can quantify, even if they’re just anecdotal. CO2 use is the only thing that would make me consider switching to a sealed and actively managed system versus my current passive setup. Now is not the time though to explain to my wife I need to buy more temperature control and room seals she’s already real displeased with the energy costs lol.. per usual though she’ll change her tune when I produce a years worth of product that will smoke her dispensary choices

 

[noydb07]

I missed your response, my bad. I would love an update on this and what you’ve observed happening once you’ve got some results you can quantify, even if they’re just anecdotal. CO2 use is the only thing that would make me consider switching to a sealed and actively managed system versus my current passive setup. Now is not the time though to explain to my wife I need to buy more temperature control and room seals she’s already real displeased with the energy costs lol.. per usual though she’ll change her tune when I produce a years worth of product that will smoke her dispensary choices

The last few months have been an interesting time since I wasn't able to control the humidity in the room without it climbing to 80%+ rh , I was basically forced to shut down CO2 for now until I can afford a larger or more efficient dehumidification unit. Currently I'm running not one but 2 dehumidifiers in my flower room which equals plenty of warmth! Lol I will post an update on this as my room was built for CO2 enrichment in mind. As soon as I get an extra 600-800 bones for the new dehu! This run the girls got full 1500ppm at canopy level until about day 30 flower and it was shut off. Current levels are about 600 avg in my basement. Now that it's legal to grow in OHIO now y'all will be hearing from me

 

[Joe Brewster]

The last few months have been an interesting time since I wasn't able to control the humidity in the room without it climbing to 80%+ rh , I was basically forced to shut down CO2 for now until I can afford a larger or more efficient dehumidification unit. Currently I'm running not one but 2 dehumidifiers in my flower room which equals plenty of warmth! Lol I will post an update on this as my room was built for CO2 enrichment in mind. As soon as I get an extra 600-800 bones for the new dehu! This run the girls got full 1500ppm at canopy level until about day 30 flower and it was shut off. Current levels are about 600 avg in my basement. Now that it's legal to grow in OHIO now y'all will be hearing from me

Welcome , nice grow @NickHardy & @Bill284 both run CO2 in their grow rooms maybe they can chime in

 

[Bill284]

Welcome , nice grow @NickHardy & @Bill284 both run CO2 in their grow rooms maybe they can chime in

Hey Joe
What can I add to that ? freeken Amazing.
Commercial dehumidifier and your golden.
Fantastic Grow my friend.


Stay safe
Bill284

 

[Keffka]

The last few months have been an interesting time since I wasn't able to control the humidity in the room without it climbing to 80%+ rh , I was basically forced to shut down CO2 for now until I can afford a larger or more efficient dehumidification unit. Currently I'm running not one but 2 dehumidifiers in my flower room which equals plenty of warmth! Lol I will post an update on this as my room was built for CO2 enrichment in mind. As soon as I get an extra 600-800 bones for the new dehu! This run the girls got full 1500ppm at canopy level until about day 30 flower and it was shut off. Current levels are about 600 avg in my basement. Now that it's legal to grow in OHIO now y'all will be hearing from me

I’m not surprised you’re struggling to keep the rh down. 40 gallons of soil by itself will keep the rh elevated in my attic passive system during winter in a 4x4, never mind when there’s plants in full flower draining the pots every few days.

With a canopy like yours, in a room like yours in the basement, that’s a pretty tall order. You may wind up saving on the back end though. One strong dehumidifier running as needed is much more efficient than multiple smaller ones running full tilt. Or even better all three running at 25% so you’re not wearing down the equipment

Plants look great regardless, thanks for stopping back in!

 

[bluter]

is there an extractor exhausting to outdoor ? easiest and cheapest way to bring the rh down is move air out of the space.

 

[noydb07]

is there an extractor exhausting to outdoor ? easiest and cheapest way to bring the rh down is move air out of the space.

I do have an exhaust fan exiting the room but not to outdoors. It's actually just out of the room into the next room but it is sucking out so much CO2 when it is on and doesn't help keep the humidity down as much as need it to (even in addition to the two dehumidifiers). The exhaust is an AC infinity 4 inch . I am pretty sure at this point I'm going to set up a nice commercial dehu, and keep at enrichment the next run once I can afford it! Just short a bit on funds. I'll post pics of the setup once I clear it out next week! And I'd appreciate everyone's input for the next setup if y'all wanna build a grow through me !?!?!

 

[Keffka]

I do have an exhaust fan exiting the room but not to outdoors. It's actually just out of the room into the next room but it is sucking out so much CO2 when it is on and doesn't help keep the humidity down as much as need it to (even in addition to the two dehumidifiers). The exhaust is an AC infinity 4 inch . I am pretty sure at this point I'm going to set up a nice commercial dehu, and keep at enrichment the next run once I can afford it! Just short a bit on funds. I'll post pics of the setup once I clear it out next week! And I'd appreciate everyone's input for the next setup if y'all wanna build a grow through me !?!?!

Heat and airflow are your best bets for lowering humidity. Raising either one will lower humidity, raising both is twice as effective. With a canopy your size I would recommend at least a 6 inch exhaust fan, but that’s just based on the visual, I forget your room size.

I assume your intake air is coming in from the same place you’re exhausting to which is probably making it more difficult to control the rh since it’s just recycling. If you can figure a way to exhaust it outdoors through a basement window (there are a lot of pretty cool designs to do this that are sleek and low profile if that’s a concern) then you would find it easier to control as well. Unless I misunderstood and you’re exhausting into a completely different room. Even then I’d be cautious because if you’re sucking air in aggressively it may be pulling that humid air back in but I’m just spitballing with that.

Under LEDs your room can go as hot as 85F as long as your plant tops aren’t exceeding 86-88F you can use this heat to cut the rh down. I have 3 oscillating fans and 4 stationary fans that I use when stuff gets too humid as well. If it doesn’t cut the rh enough it will at least keep the buds from molding as long as I can get the air flowing through all the colas. Air flow is going to be your best friend and heat is your side chick when it comes to rh

If you can remember to, tag me when you setup your next journal, you spare no expense so I enjoy living vicariously through you

 

[bluter]

I do have an exhaust fan exiting the room but not to outdoors.

you won't dial it in until you solve for exhaust. all you are doing now is recirculating the same stuff you are trying to remove from the grow space.

It's actually just out of the room into the next room but it is sucking out so much CO2 when it is on and doesn't help keep the humidity down as much as need it to (even in addition to the two dehumidifiers). The exhaust is an AC infinity 4 inch .

you're having issues because you are recirculating spent air.

I am pretty sure at this point I'm going to set up a nice commercial dehu, and keep at enrichment the next run once I can afford it! Just short a bit on funds. I'll post pics of the setup once I clear it out next week! And I'd appreciate everyone's input for the next setup if y'all wanna build a grow through me !?!?!

you can do it with dehums, but you're gonna spend 30 times the amount on power conditioning the air to get there than you would if you set up better. you'll probably need to add ac as well if you haven't already.

with proper exhaust you could set up with an rh, temp, and c02 controler. then you just set your parameters and let it work.

edit : your extractor is decent. you might try something a bit larger, but i'm not sure how it'll help if you're already having issues with the c02 staying. usually the c02 settles near the bottom as it it heavier than 02. you have to be careful with pets around it, they breathe closer to the ground.

 

[bluter]

forgot to add i like the distribution tubing.
the whole kit suggests you wouldn't have much difficulty dialing it in further. it's a gorgeous set up.

 

[noydb07]

I am technically recirculating the air when the exhaust is in use. I suppose my hope would be to be able to get the humidity into the drain through the dehumidifier that way I won't be wasting CO2 with an exhaust fan. I should likely install a larger exhaust fan as well even if it's just for the high RH days... Or vent it to the outside as suggested.