WW/Wappa 2L Hempy GLR 1st Grow!

[SauronBlue]

Im not so sure shes gonna recover. Looks like root rot or stem breakage

I think root rot would make perfect sense, since I guess they were essentially water-logged while the gel was covering them. Glad I forgot to do this on the first 4 that I transplanted. I was actually pissed that I hadn't used it on the roots! Live and learn. I must disagree with your prognosis, however, as I saw the roots peeking out again in new places, so that mirrors the new-leaf growth in telling me that she's still fighting to live. While there have been no new growths, the inner leaves are staying green and firm. Stick around, and I'll try to make you a believer

 

[Granny420]

SauronBlue

Found ya honey! Actually, I visited yesterday and tried to catch up on your journal, but didn't have time to write. Short on time today too, but here anyway!

As for the plant you are worried about (#3), since it happened directly after transplanting, I would say that is most likely where the problem lies. I have had plants that were doing wonderful until transplanted - and then did similar things to what yours is doing. For me, I babied them and made sure I didn't cause them any further stress ... and after 2 to 4 weeks (some took longer than others), they rooted in again and grew me some dandy plants. And yes, all growth kindda just stopped and some leaves died... but given time, growth began again and then wah-lah, fine growing plant again (just a month behind in my PLAN for a cycle!)

Also... I replied to your question about pre-flowers in my journal and included real good pics if you are still wondering about how to recognize them. Once you learn to recognize them, sexing is a breeze!!!

Yer doing a wonderful job with your girls - keep it up!!!

 

[Granny420]

I forgot to add a link to this article in 420magazine:
Cannabis Plant and Pest Problem Solver - Pictorial

The only words of advice I will give BEFORE you visit is... DON'T OVER THINK OR OVER DO!!! This article has a ton of images, with some damage looking very similar to others. If you are POSITIVE of the problem, go for a treatment... but if you are UNSURE - do NOT. Treatments can easily KILL YOUR PLANT if it is not the correct treatment. But this pictorial problem solver was sure a help to me - I was OVER watering in the beginning and almost killed off a bunch of plants... but this helped me figure it out and I babied those lil gals back to excellent results too.

Keep it SIMPLE. We watch our girls and have such LOVE and PRIDE in seeing them grow... sometimes we watch and puff puff puff puff... we start getting these ideas rolling that this or that would be helpful... so we do it (especially beginning growers)... and a few days later - UGH!!! So.. anything different you do - do sparingly (especially nutes) until you are sure of how the plant is reacting.

Also... I think you had a gnat problem? I did too with my first grow. I OVER treated for those too and tried a ton of things to get rid of them. If you just have a few - don't worry about it. If you develop a larger problem here is what worked the best for me: A small hunk of mosquito dunk (1/6 of a circle dunk) soaked 24 to 48 hours in one gallon of water - then I mixed 4 cups of this per gallon of water I used to water my plants (soil here), kept them under control very nicely and didn't hurt my plants.

Also, if you put a bit of lemongrass essential oil in a container in the room, it will do two things: attract the gnats (they seem to love it and they drown themselves) and it will smell lemony in your grow room! I add up to a half a teaspoon (or just a few drops for a smaller area) to a candle warmer (heat brings out the scent) whenever I need/want to. The scent only lasts a day or so tho, so small amounts are all that is needed (10 drops will do it for a day in a small area).

That's it for sure now!!! Gotta go take care of my girls!!!

 

[Granny420]

I think root rot would make perfect sense, since I guess they were essentially water-logged while the gel was covering them. Glad I forgot to do this on the first 4 that I transplanted. I was actually pissed that I hadn't used it on the roots! Live and learn. I must disagree with your prognosis, however, as I saw the roots peeking out again in new places, so that mirrors the new-leaf growth in telling me that she's still fighting to live. While there have been no new growths, the inner leaves are staying green and firm. Stick around, and I'll try to make you a believer

I don't know how I missed a couple posts where you had uprooted the plant to view the roots (GREAT JOB!!!). I was not even updated when I wrote yesterday - EEK (it's hell to git old!!!) I agree with you that she is still fighting to survive (new root growth). Sounds like you have done exactly what is needed! This plant may be set back for some time, but I bet given time you'll get her to come on back to shine! GOOD LUCK!!!

And I apologize if I offended in anyway by saying keep it simple. You are SO RIGHT about what you wrote on how difficult it is to tell what this means!!! Like now, if you had taken my advice on letting the plant recover from transplant... well it may have died. But, what you DID was to watch her closely and give her time to recover a bit before taking ANY action (GREAT JOB!!!) and when she showed signs of continued struggling, you did what you had to to check the roots - very very very very VERY GOOD JOB!! THAT was exactly what I meant - don't just jump in and do something instantly because you see something different... but evaluate and only do something if really NEEDED - YOU DID!!!

I can't wait to see how nice your plants turn out. The young stage is the hardest stage to me because they are so fragile in the beginning. But your girls are growing now - and you will be able to sit back and relax a bit pretty soon... and stare at them in wonder at how quickly they grow from this point on!!! I'm looking forward to new pics cuz I bet there is a lot of growth in your other plants already!

It is exciting to watch this grow because you are obviously so tuned into getting it right! You are gonna grow some REAL FINE GIRLS!!!

I love that you have White Widow! It is an EXCELLENT strain to grow! The White strains tend to be a bit harsher in hitting - but WOW do they pack a hell of a buzz!!! Prime smoke.
I hope you don't mind that I will include a couple links here - in case you want to review the results I got from my White Widow (height, bud structure, trichs, etc). These links are direct to the harvesting of the first 3 WW I grew...
Two WW harvested on day 67 of Flower
One WW harvested on day 80 of Flower
My current flowering girls are not quite 3 weeks in flower, so buds are forming everywhere - but not quite the beauties as shown in those harvest pics. It was kindda nice to review how beautiful the girls all get by harvest.

It looks like you are doing a wonderful job of setting up your girls - you are way ahead of this simple soil grow girl!!! I will watch and LEARN!!

I'm tuned in to watch how exciting your grow is for YOU!!!

 

[MSquared]

Very nice going so far

I think you are correct and it is the rooting gel and the water. that coco will really hold the h2o in. I think you also correct in thinking that she is fighting. You wait she be a good one that will hold a spacial place in your heart throughout your grow.
I am love growing and I too stress over every clone and bean I have too, its all part of the love for me
Keep doing what you are doing! You will have a successful grow.

 

[SauronBlue]

And I apologize if I offended in anyway by saying keep it simple.

Quite the contrary, G420, I want to stress to you that I in no way took any offense to what you said, and my shpiel about what it means to "keep it simple" was more than anything, just my dry, Jerry-Seinfeld-esque humor peeking out. I'm glad and flattered that you would do me the honor to just post in my thread! I welcome any and all to view and post my thread, I just try to keep a respectful and informative vibe going. From your own threads, it is clear that you have a wealth of knowledge to share, and I hope you feel welcome to give any opinions or advice! I'm sure any links you post will be appropriate and useful.
As for my girlies, Thank you for the kind words! They are all doing well, except #3, who is apparently still alive, but very, very weak. I am on my 2nd full day of using an MH conversion bulb in my HPS setup, and they seem to be responding well to the change. I have been going through some serious stress at work, so I haven't kept up on here, but I will get an update in tonight. Knowing that there's someone interested in their progress is a bit more motivating, but I need to stay up to date for my own records, anyways.

 

[SauronBlue]

So, I managed to leave my camera cord at work, as I use the same camera there. I tell you, nothing's going my way lately. I don't want to put all the descriptions with no pictures, so I'll have to renege on that promise to post today. The short story is, I'm seeing awesome growth, especially in the coco pots, and #3 is still a hairs breadth from the brink. I hope to give everyone something interesting to watch, and maybe you can learn what not to do by watching all of my mistakes!

 

[Twelve12]

Things are looking good. Like your DIY carbon filter. You know how to put things together. Looks like the rapid rooter is a bit too wet giving root rot. Those things can add up in time. I've used them before and decided to cut the cost and switch to paper towel germination method, then transplant the seed directly into the container. I don't do seed to 2L yet, since it's reserved for clones only, but it should work just fine. Later on when you decide to clone, make yourself an aero cloner it will save on the rapid rooters and provide stress free. I got 99.9% success using it. I'm sure you'll have no hard time putting together one.

 

[SauronBlue]

Things are looking good. Like your DIY carbon filter. You know how to put things together. Looks like the rapid rooter is a bit too wet giving root rot. Those things can add up in time. I've used them before and decided to cut the cost and switch to paper towel germination method, then transplant the seed directly into the container. I don't do seed to 2L yet, since it's reserved for clones only, but it should work just fine. Later on when you decide to clone, make yourself an aero cloner it will save on the rapid rooters and provide stress free. I got 99.9% success using it. I'm sure you'll have no hard time putting together one.

Thanks for dropping a line T12. I agree that it's root rot, but I think it was smearing rooting gel all over the roots at transplant that almost killed my girl. I was confused on the usage of rooting gel. I have an aero cloner that I made myself, but since I'm not at the point to use it, I haven't included it in the journal yet. I plan on trying a different propagation media than that next time I germinate seeds, these rapid rooters are finicky, they stay really wet while above the full res tray, then get really dry quickly once that goes dry.

 

[SauronBlue]

So, here, finally is the newest update! The girls have gone wild with the new MH bulb! I'm seeing some crazy growth- a definite improvement over the HPS. The leaves are darker green, stiffer, and feel hairy now, like poison oak. There is a smell starting to come from them, but it doesn't really strike me as a "weedy" smell, but I only get a quick whiff when I start messing with them, and my nose quickly adjusts. The 2 in coco are exhibiting a faster growth rate than the p/v mix. The p/v are lighter in color, taller and thinner than the 2 in coco. I believe this is due to the plants having more water in the period when their roots don't touch the res. I don't feel like p/v holds onto much of the water, so the plant needs good long roots to get at the res to thrive. The plants that I FIM'd started off slow to recover under the HPS, but the leaves are healing rapidly now, and the growth is so dense in there that it's hard to even see what's going on! I sis not FIM #1, mainly for comparison. I wouldv'e left one of each, but I need so many clones from these few that I decided to FIM both of the coco plants, since they were doing so well. #3 is still almost dead, but just the fact that she hasn't gone completely shriveled and dead in these last few days is proof positive that there is still blood(or at least water) pumping thru her veins! I've trimmed all the brown fan leaves to keep them from weighing her down and hindering new growth(after carefully watching her progrees for a few days [shout-outs to Granny420!]). I have moved all nutrient bottles and water bottles out of my tent, as I think the light and heat were causing particles to form in the clear bottles of mixed nute-water. All the food is now in a cool, dark closet.
I've been told that my temps will go down with an MH bulb, but this MH conversion is WAY hotter than the HPS, in my opinion. Luckily my clean air comes from an A/C unit, so I can control the temp of what is blown in. I've had to increase the cooling, and I have detected a notable increase in outside room temps(as the temt vents into the outer room) - to the point where I've had to leave widows open (in NOV), while other roomates have space heaters going. I was very comfy with the outer room temps before the switch.

 

[SauronBlue]

Sitting here with a glass of Shiraz, smoking a bowl of Hindu Kush, tending to my girls, and marveling at nature's gifts
There is a noticeable progression since yesterday, as you can see by scrolling back and forth. The ones that were clipped seem to be growing new shoots from lower levels as well - not just from the area that was clipped. I think I can see the preflowers that Granny's trying to show me. I definitely don't see any balls. The difference in volume between coco and p/v continue to exaggerate. Even as the perlite pots grow fuller and thicker, the coco pots are way ahead and not slowing down. It makes sense that the coco pots are drinking deeper than the perlite, 25-50% more. #2 is getting more pungent every day. She still doesn't smell like weed, but there is a definite piney odor. The one Wappa is starting to show purple in the new growth. #3 has not changed at all since the last pic. I have been giving her minimal water, but making sure not to let her dry out. Today I moved her out of the main spray of the light, as she is now more of a seedling, and therefore I figure she'll do better with less lumens bombarding her.
I had to rearrange the hood on my light, because the MH conversion bulb is like 2.5 times the diameter of the HPS, so it just didn't fit like it was. I dropped the hood while trying to adjust it and gave #2 that scratch on her leaf. As I said earlier, that bulb also runs MUCH hotter, I'd say 10-20f hotter than the HPS. I just realized today that the 3rd week of life for these plants will start on Tuesday. This is less than 3 weeks from germination! I know it may not be anything special by what some of you guys are doing, but I am psyched! I finally drilled all the holes in my aero-cloner lid, but I was planning on going with 24 sites, and ended up with room for 35, so I've gotta pick up a few more disks before the show really begins - but I've got a couple weeks, and other than that, It's done, and tested to spray very well. Even with just the few plants that I'm working with now, I'm glad to have this pipettor to measure, as I'd need to fill that little dropper dozens of times to get thru a fill-up. As it is now, I can use it easily with one hand or quickly with two, and fit enough nutes in one squirt to cover the dose for a gallon. I can see that it will be inefficient to mix less than 5 gallons at a time once I have 30+ going. If they drink up to 8oz each, that's almost 2gal per feeding. My gnats have long since disappeared. there were never very many, and I'm glad I didn't bother putting neem on my babies, but it's here if I need it.
All in all, they seem to be very healthy with this setup. There is no yellowing, browning, or bright streaks on anything, the stems are all very strong, and the only deformities other than a few twisted leaves (I hear this may be caused by swings in ph?) are just where they're growing back from FIMming. I can't wait for them to grow out a bit and see if the growth continues to be this dense, or if they start to stretch more.

 

[Twelve12]

Plants looks good. Like the tight nodes. Keep up the good work!

 

[SauronBlue]

So, I'm going to call it. Official time of death: 5:55pm November 14th, 2011. I think #3 could possibly still have a chance(maybe just b/c I'm too dumb to know better), but I saw some mold or spiderwebs or something like that in the hole that the stem is poking out of. Even though I think she still has a chance, it's not worth risking all 4 of the others to TRY to save her. I'm gonna have to cut my losses. My biggest question is, what to do with the coco from this pot?I'm still a good 3-4 weeks from dropping any new girls in pots, should I chuck this whole thing, save it as it is(with the plug and dead plant removed) to await future use, or re-bag the media

On the brighter side, I can still see the growth every time I check on them. It's really exciting seeing them grow like this, and they're just really starting to burst! I'm gonna wait a day or two between spreads, and really make the difference pop!

 

[SauronBlue]

Here's a quick update. All the girls are filling out, and growth is coming from everywhere, although the coco's are still leading the pack by far. Temps with the a/c have been steady between 75-90f. Yesterday was the second flush, and still have very green growth with minimal deformities. I tried to count the would-be clones on #2, and I have no doubt that inside of 2 weeks I'll have more than the 30 clones I was hoping for. The only reason I wont keep a mother at this point is budgetary concerns. I really hope I can work a mom into my plans before I chop, as I really want a mommy!

 

[Twelve12]

Plants are looking good. They will start to show deficiency after 1/2 in bloom if flush is skipped. Remember to feed plain water only once a week to flush out the salts. Let it try out 1 day then resume feeding.

 

[SauronBlue]

Thanks 12. I flush them every Tuesday, the same day they popped from the seeds.

I have been a bit of a klutz in the last week. I dropped a duct fan on #4, bending her stalk, knocking over #6, and dinging a few leaves on 1 and 2 in the process. I had #4 tied to a stick with a bread-tie for a few days, but have released her(the stick is still there, and visible in one of the pics). I've clipped most of the damaged leaves, but some that are still largely green have been left to try to reduce the shock. Given the abuse they've taken, they are looking great. I can see now that I am going to be able to clip at least 10 clones off each of these plants once I get ready to. The perlite plants have caught up in height, but still lack the fullness of the coco plants. The only one that strikes me as really having 2 main colas after the FIMming is #2, which I clipped first, and closest to the stem. I clipped about 90% of the leaf on her, then down to about 70% on #6. I'm giving each plant about 6oz of nuted water a day(except flush tuesdays) at the end of the light cycle. I have been using the tachno flora nute kit that I bought on my house plants, as I am using only Blue Planet Nutrients 2-part (though I am using TF and AN additives, and no disrespect to Technaflora, I just have nothing else to do with the nutes I bought, so the houseplants are a testing ground), and I saw awesome growth when I added thrive alive B-1 in their water, so I added it to my girls as well. The following pics are pre- B-1. I finished setting up the ventilation system. I did notice a 5-10f drop by adding the powered filter, but there is still a positive pressure in the tent, so I'm sure I'll have some smell leakage when they get stinky. I may need a hi-powered fan, or maybe I'll switch the powered intake from the a/c to a passive intake from the hole in the window. The outside temps are staring to fall low enough to use in place of the a/c. I've tested my cloner, and it works beautifully, but for some reason the pump leans in the tub, so I'm gonna have to find something to prop it up level once it's in use.


Plant 1:

Plant 6:

Plant 4:

Plant 2:

As I'm sure you noticed, there are a few spotted leaves, but I can't find any evidence of bugs, and the damage seems to have been caused from above, as that is where the leaves are indented. If something waschewing on the leaves, i'd expect the indentations to be underneath, where the bugs can hangout in the shade. Also, there is only one leaf on each of three plants with spotting, and they all look different. Some of the other leaves are lighter colored, but only these have spots:

 

[SauronBlue]

Brainfart

 

[geno]

sorry if I didn't get back in a promt time. I'm not very computor savy, and they make my head hurt trying to get around on them. Your babes look healthy, I read you correctly 3 wks. That's good growth. I've read that using grow medians and hydro is more productive, that's looking good. Dirt, that's me. I still believe in simple is best. The discoloration is all on your lower leaves I'd just trim them off. all your top growth is reaching up so your doing things right. it's a proud moment when your sampling/ sharing something others think comes from far far away.

 

[1970s Grower]

I think the plants look pretty good.

Your last pic does look like a pest though. Have you looked with a jeweler rouge or a magnifier for pests? The two pics above that one look like something from above spilled on it. I get these mystery spots from time to time also.

It kind of sucks when you take the time to post good pics and you get little response. Alot of people with travel and family commitments I guess.

 

[SauronBlue]

Geno: thanks for responding, period, don't worry about time- I's not a job interview! lol. I'm just happy that people care enough to respond at all. Y'know, at first I was kinda miffed that I wasn't getting activity here like I see on 420fied and Twelve12's threads, but I have come to understand that these guys have been out there helping people and making a name for themselves for a while. What the hell right do I have to expect people to take part in my journal - I don't even post in most threads that I read! So I am now just focusing on the useful information I can get from this later, and being thankful for the fact that I even have a community like this to be a part of. I feel bad when I think about how little I do to help others here, but as I gain experience, I will be sure to return the favor! This site is a model for the world! If we could all stop trying to compete with each other, and just learn from each other, help each other, and care for them like we do ourselves, like on 420mag. I'm rambling, these meds are nice.:focus:
What I believe is that you are in an awesome position! Let me explain;
I believe simple is best to start. period. In order to learn how to do something, you start small and get the basics down, but at some point, the talented and the driven must then take their understanding of the process to find ways to make it better. You learn better ways to water your plants, find cheaper supply sources, rearrange space, right? So why wouldn't you also improve the most important part? In MY life I need to have forward motion. But now that you have that experience, you already understand your plants, so that is no longer a challenge. This frees you up to try new things with an eye for what already works for you. If you have your lighting setup perfectly, then you can play with the media or hydro part, and not have the lights be an issue. If you're comfortable in soil, you can try LED lighting, and you'd know step by step if it's better or worse compared. I'm still rambling, but point is, get out of your comfort zone, and have some fun. Grow an extra plant or two, and play with them. I don't have extra MJ yet, but I use my house plants for experimenting.

1970's:Thanks for the compliment! They are pretty damn cute, if I do say so myself. I haven't gotten a loupe yet, but I have examined the leaves pretty well, and there are no bites or anything under the leaves, the only indents are on the top, what pest eats from the top of the leaf? Also, the phenomenon is not spreading, and I take out each plant daily to water them, and I check them out pretty well. I actually just clipped these leaves this morning, as I like to watch for a day or two before reacting to anything. There was no expansion of the effect on any of the leaves, or spreading to other leaves. The only changes were in what shade the leaves or spots were, and even that wasn't extreme, just green to yellow, yellow to brown - other than those weird black spots, which came out of no where. All of those changes happened over a period of like 3 days that I was running around a lot, and working in/on the tent a lot. I was pretty all-over-the-place, and wasn't paying much attention to what I was doing.

Thanks for your support, guys!