My Grow

[Buds Buddy]

N (No3-) = Nitrate
N (NH4+) = Ammonium
Note to self: Don't confuse Nitrate Nitrogen with Nitrate. They are different & Nitrate Nitrogen is much stronger.
The Natures Nectar Nitrogen only says Total Nitrogen 5.0% but no info on how much of each type. Is this an issue ?
I'll try finding the info on the manufacturers site.

 

[InTheShed]

And the "P" stays at 0 ppm or 20% of "N" ?

Leave P at 0 as it will usually end up over 20% of N anyway.

Do you think I could post the charts (making sure not to put any logos, etc.) & not catch any flack ? I'd like to post them when I need a specific question answered.

You can certainly PM them to me but I don't know about posting here.

What is the chart called that gives you all the info on (N, Si, S, Mg, etc.)

It's the "Guaranteed Analysis" list on the back of the bottle/bag.

I need to know which "N" is which by the by the letters & numbers they use. Nitrate Nitrogen = (?) / Ammonical Nitrogen = (?).
Available Phosphate = (P2O5)

The database entry section gives you separate boxes for nitrate (NO3) and ammoniacal (NH4). When you put in your P, if it's listed on the label as P2O5 then drop down the P arrow and change it. The software will sort out the calculations for you. Same for K2SO4.

Natures Nectar Nitrogen only says Total Nitrogen 5.0% but no info on how much of each type.

I'd enter is as nitrate even though it's not listed.

 

[Buds Buddy]

Leave P at 0 as it will usually end up over 20% of N anyway.

You can certainly PM them to me but I don't know about posting here.

It's the "Guaranteed Analysis" list on the back of the bottle/bag.

The database entry section gives you separate boxes for nitrate (NO3) and ammoniacal (NH4). When you put in your P, if it's listed on the label as P2O5 then drop down the P arrow and change it. The software will sort out the calculations for you. Same for K2SO4.

I'd enter is as nitrate even though it's not listed.

OK, so I'm not really sure how to fill in the Data Base because the only thing that has any info on the package is Mega Crop. There's no info on the Natures Nectar Nitrogen or the MSA Stout bottles. Couldn't find any info on line for it either.
I did find this on Natures Nectar Nitrogen & thought it might help someone out.

NATURES NECTAR NITROGEN 1L
Nature's NectarTM is the leading natural organic nutrient in commercial food and fruit production. Nature's NectarTM solution contains no sediment and has been manufactured so all nutrients are instantly available to your plant. Nature's NectarTM, for exceptional growth, quality and yield.
Guaranteed Minimum Analysis is Nitrogen (N) 5.0%.
Nature's NectarTM Nitrogen is completely solublized, instantly available source of nitrogen with no sediment. Fully 13% of the formula contains 21 free amino acids. Provides nutrition for beneficial bacteria improving conditions of growing medium. Increases photosynthesis for a greener plant.
Derived from protein hydrolysate. Use 1 1/2 teaspoons per gallon of water.
Q: Why don't I need to adjust pH when using Nature's Nectar?
A: Mineral based hydroponic solutions are very simple and many contain only 6 or 12 ions that are easy to control with acids or bases. True organic formulations are very complex and contain hundreds of species that the plants can utilize at varying pH levels.
Q: What is the reason I can't have bubblers in my reservoir?
A: Bubblers take airborne bacteria and inject them into a pool of water and organic nutrients. That is a perfect recipe for creating bacterial growth in the reservoir.
Q: I have a very expensive PPM pen. Why is your nutrient not registering?
A : Mineral or chemical based nutrient solutions carry an electrical charge that ultimately makes your pen pick up the ppm. Our OMRI/PRO-CERT listed Nature's Nectar raw materials and finished solutions carry no electrical charge. No matter how expensive the pen is, it is useless when using with true organics. Those gardeners who are just starting in the hobby can save money by not purchasing this piece of equipment.
Q: I notice Nature's Nectar is a stand alone certified organic solution but has no micros? How can this be?
A : There is Calcium in Nature's Nectar Phosphorus plus Iron, Magnesium and Calcium in Nature's Nectar Potassium. The levels of these nutrients are acceptable to.
several states but also unacceptable to a few. This would lead to EZ-GRO having to print several labels which we want to avoid. For additional micros we have OMRI listed Organa Add. It contains all micros in an organic form and it should be sprayed every 7 - 10 days at 2 ml / L.

 

[Buds Buddy]

So on the "Main Page" I enter all the Basic Info : Gal., ppm, etc.
Then click on Substances used & then add custom solution ?
Copy info from MC 9-6-17 & add to Data Base ?
Then add the Natures Nectar Nitrogen 5-0-0 to Data Base as Nitrate (NO3-) as the "Only Thing In It" ?
Q: I guess this is Nitrogen only with no Ca, Mg, Fe, or anything else in it ?

Then add the Alchemist Stout MSA to Data Base as just Si ? Didn't see a way to choose which type of Silica I'm using.
Or is there a way to enter it as H4SiO4 ?
Bottle says: Contains Non Plant Food Ingredient: 1.25% Monosilicic Acid
Q: Do I need to enter the 1.25% info anywhere ?

 

[Buds Buddy]

Hope I'm not boring you guys too much. I didn't tag anyone this time because I thought it might. This journal is mainly so I can learn how to do calculations on my own. But if you are interested please stick around & learn it with me. Ask questions too; but you will have to wait for Shed to answer .... lol. There are No Dumb Questions ! The more questions.... The more we learn & get it right.
I have to give a Big Thank You to Shed for taking the time to help me with this. I'd be totally lost !

 

[LKABudMan]

I'm very interested in mixing my own nutes. Please keep posting all of the boring stuff. I might not get to this for a couple of months when the boring stuff becomes important details Thanks for putting this together Buds.

 

[farside05]

My Water pH out of the tap & after sitting for 2 days was 7.7 pH.
Once I added the nutes the pH was 6.9
Had to add 0.5 ml. of pH down to get the pH to 6.3

You're growing in FFOF, which is a buffered medium. There is no need to adjust the pH of your nutrient solution, the medium takes care of that for you. Eliminate the unnecessary step and cost. Many of the pH Down products have some sort of N-P-K of their own (ie 1-5-0) and do nothing but screw up the ratios you're trying to obtain.

 

[farside05]

If you're interested, I've got some info on my thread on blending your own.

This post has a consolidated list on things to buy (it's a bit expensive at first) and amounts used to make each product.

There's some instructions HERE on the actual making of the nutrient concentrates.

 

[Buds Buddy]

If you're interested, I've got some info on my thread on blending your own.

This post has a consolidated list on things to buy (it's a bit expensive at first) and amounts used to make each product.

There's some instructions HERE on the actual making of the nutrient concentrates.

Thanks ! I'll check out the info you passed on. Much appreciated.

 

[InTheShed]

Because of the nutes you're using the data entry is easy. The Nitrogen has one entry: 5 in the NO3 field and that's all. Same with the Stout, where you just enter 1.25 in the Si field.

Done!

 

[Buds Buddy]

Because of the nutes you're using the data entry is easy. The Nitrogen has one entry: 5 in the NO3 field and that's all. Same with the Stout, where you just enter 1.25 in the Si field.

Done!

Thanks! That just seemed a little too simple, so I had to ask.

 

[Buds Buddy]

Wow ! I have to ask myself.... What the F____ ? This is one of my 3 plants at 27 days old in this journal Photos, Soil, Mars Hydro Grow . My current plants will No Way be that size in the next 9 days. They'll be lucky to be a 1/4th of that size. There was 3 plants in a 3x3 with 1 Mars Hydro TSW2000 on these girls. Not sure why my current plants are so small compared to these. Feeding the same. Temps & RH are way different. They were high 80's with very low RH during that grow. But with the correct temp & RH : 77F & 65 - 70% RH I got way smaller plants. Could this be it ?
That grow I kept my light up high & ran at 75% and higher. This grow it's at 12" & at 35%. Could this be it ? Only 2 factors that have really changed so I'm thinking it has to be one of them or both.

Going to take pics of my current plants to post in a few. See you then !

 

[Buds Buddy]

OK, got the pics. But while doing so was thinking about the differences in grows.
1) I up-potted to 2 gal. pots last time & 1 gal. pots this time. I don't think that's much of a factor.

2) The Temps were higher last time making the soil dry faster & requiring me to feed more often. I was already at 3 gr. MC by the time the plants were 28 days old. Only on 2 gr. at 18 days old this time & temps are lower. Taking 5 days + for my pots to dry out. I do think this is part of it so I'm breaking out the Laser Thermometer to see what the leaf temps are at different tent temps. I think there's about a 5 degree difference.... but not sure.

3) The RH was really low last time which most likely also helped the pots dry faster & required me to feed more often.
Again, I think this plays a part in it.

4) Lux / Photosynthesis may also be playing a part in this as I had my light much higher & brighter last time. I'm going to watch some Dr. Bruce Bugby videos on light today to see if I can optimize things. For now, I did raise my light 6" which puts me at 18" from the canopy. Light is at 75% which gives me 30,100 Lux. 30,000 is the low setting for Veg so I'll increase it slowly or just let the plants grow into the light till the leaves start to curl down to avoid it.
I think turning the power up on the light should raise my temps a little & lower the RH some. Maybe then the soil will dry faster & they'll get fed more.

5) Honestly, I don't have a clue really. Just the thoughts of different possibilities going through my head.... lol.

So let's get to the pics I took less than an hour ago. They're so small I feel like they should only be 10 days old & not 18.

Pics of all 4 :

POP TARTS & WHITE WIDOW :

POP TARTS :

WHITE WIDOW :

 

[Buds Buddy]

OG KUSH & AURORA INDICA :

OG KUSH :

AURORA INDICA :

I last fed on the 17th. They still wont need anything for a couple of days unless things start drying out faster. I will feed the last 1/2 gal. I have mixed at 2 gr. per gallon when I do. Debating on whether or not to go to 2.5 or jump to 3 gr. per gal. 4th nodes will be totally developed.... maybe even the 5th by then. 4th is coming in now.

Anybody got any thoughts on why these might be growing so slowly ?
I hate to say this.... but, it sure seems like things grow much faster when your environment is totally out of whack.

 

[farside05]

I last fed on the 17th. They still wont need anything for a couple of days unless things start drying out faster. I will feed the last 1/2 gal. I have mixed at 2 gr. per gallon when I do. Debating on whether or not to go to 2.5 or jump to 3 gr. per gal. 4th nodes will be totally developed.... maybe even the 5th by then. 4th is coming in now.

Anybody got any thoughts on why these might be growing so slowly ?
I hate to say this.... but, it sure seems like things grow much faster when your environment is totally out of whack.

My MC schedule in soil-less went by days old.
1-5 days old, 1mg
6-10 days old, 2mg
11-15, 3mg
16-20, 4mg
21-25, 5mg
26 to finish, 6mg

I realize you're in FFOF which has some nutrients vs a blank canvas of a peat based soil-less mix, but you might want to ramp up the feed a little more.

As far as size vs another crop. Was that other plant the same strain? Some strains seem to jump out of the ground faster to me while others seem to spend a bunch of time growing beneath the soil and then explode with growth. Example, Northern always seems to be a laggard at first in my garden, but then comes roaring back to catch up.

 

[Buds Buddy]

My MC schedule in soil-less went by days old.
1-5 days old, 1mg
6-10 days old, 2mg
11-15, 3mg
16-20, 4mg
21-25, 5mg
26 to finish, 6mg

I realize you're in FFOF which has some nutrients vs a blank canvas of a peat based soil-less mix, but you might want to ramp up the feed a little more.

As far as size vs another crop. Was that other plant the same strain? Some strains seem to jump out of the ground faster to me while others seem to spend a bunch of time growing beneath the soil and then explode with growth. Example, Northern always seems to be a laggard at first in my garden, but then comes roaring back to catch up.

I thought of it possibly being the strain, but when all 3 of the fem seeds stay small at the same time I find it unlikely.
But I hope you're right & they get their asses moving.... lol.
The one bag seed (Fem. or male ?) is the tallest but it could be a Sativa or a male. I'd like to ramp up the feeding.... but I have to wait for the soil to dry & that's taking 5-7 days each time.

 

[Buds Buddy]

After 1 hour with light at 18" & 75% power @ 30,100 Lux the tent temp went up to 82F with 40% RH. But both tent doors were open. Leaf temps were also at 82F. Thought they were suppose to be lower due to moisture in them ? Maybe because they're so small ?
Just closed up the tent & will check everything again in 1 hour.

 

[LKABudMan]

It does make sense that the more often you water the bigger the plants. The plants need the wet/dry cycle in order to grow more roots. But I have noticed growth slowing to a crawl right before watering and the plants exploding in growth right after watering. So more wet/dry cycles should speed up veg. Maybe?
However, the plants should be taking up the optimal amount of water with the VPD dialed in. From everything I have read higher VPD will cause the plant to close stomata and reduce transpiration. So, is it the plants drinking more at a higher VPD or does the soil just dry out quicker? Can you just water less when they are younger and speed up the wet/dry cycle that way?
I love that you are comparing against old grows to optimize your environment. Right now all of my knowledge is from what I have read. The real word is not always the same
Happy Growing.

 

[farside05]

.. but I have to wait for the soil to dry & that's taking 5-7 days each time.

I guess what I'm saying is:

Say you water Day 5 (1mg level). It takes till Day 12 before they need feed. Skip to 3 mg. Bypass 2 all together. At your plants age, the next watering I'd do 4mg based on my "Days Old" schedule. You were contemplating 2.5 or 3, I'm saying you may want to go even stronger than that.

 

[Buds Buddy]

I guess what I'm saying is:

Say you water Day 5 (1mg level). It takes till Day 12 before they need feed. Skip to 3 mg. Bypass 2 all together. At your plants age, the next watering I'd do 4mg based on my "Days Old" schedule. You were contemplating 2.5 or 3, I'm saying you may want to go even stronger than that.

By the Thanks I'd say Shed agrees with you so I'll go ahead & up it to 3 gr. per gal. on the next feed.
Temp got 84F & 58% RH with doors closed. I'm thinking about setting my AC on 81F so it doesn't go over that & it still wont run as often or during lights out. Lights out temps are 75 - 77F so it shouldn't kick on. I want to go with a slightly higher temp this grow than the past couple I did at 77F through Veg & dropped it little by little in Flower. I have to see if there's a difference in yield. My biggest yields were all with high temps so I have to test this to see. 81F isn't really all that high though as long as I don't see heat stress.