1st Time Grow White Widow & Seedmakers Autoblue

Also, I know about that BPN feeding thing. That must be some good and fully organic nutes if they can stay in the soil that long without burning the plant! I would probably look into reducing the dose if they're staying as long as yours, but honestly, if they're not doing any harm, I would rather keep the same dose and NOT risk yield/potency complications :). Judging by your buds, I'd say keep the BPN the same lol :tokin:
 
thanks for the info mate, i have not tried any flushing agent as such yet, but its something im thinking about due to all my plants looking really healthy at harvest, i have also been reading on giving the plants to much nutes, now when we see nut burn this is the first sign we see of to much nutes, but by the time the ends of the leaves are turning yellow this means the plant has been stressed for a while, it seems we give them more nutes than they ever need and it does affect yield, keeping the plant healthy will always give the best yield, but by giving to much nutes we are restricting the growth as the plant tries to cope with all the nutes, when it cant cope it turns the leaves tips yellow, but by the time we see this the plant has suffered for a while, so im trying to find a sort of good guide that i can use.

now we know when plants need nutes as the leaves go light green, so we give nutes and they go back to the nice dark green, now i giving bpn with every feed was not damaging the plant or giving me any nute burn, but when i tried feeding bpn every other feed on a test plant their was no difference between the plant fed bpn with every feed and the plant fed every other feed, so this suggests the plant is still getting enough nutes to thrive, so i tried every 3rd feed thinking id come across problems such as the leaves going light green or something nute def related, but i seen none of this, the plants grew the same as the plants fed every feed, or they was doing slightly better, id need to do more testing to be sure,

reps for the info though mate, im going to look into this flushing agent as i have seen several growers use it, so ill have a look around and a read and see what i can find out, thanks for the info,

ill have to give you reps when it lets me, i must of all ready gave you reps in the last few days cuz it says i got to spread the love before giving you more reps
 
donpaul.p said:
thanks for the info mate, i have not tried any flushing agent as such yet, but its something im thinking about due to all my plants looking really healthy at harvest, i have also been reading on giving the plants to much nutes, now when we see nut burn this is the first sign we see of to much nutes, but by the time the ends of the leaves are turning yellow this means the plant has been stressed for a while, it seems we give them more nutes than they ever need and it does affect yield, keeping the plant healthy will always give the best yield, but by giving to much nutes we are restricting the growth as the plant tries to cope with all the nutes, when it cant cope it turns the leaves tips yellow, but by the time we see this the plant has suffered for a while, so im trying to find a sort of good guide that i can use.

now we know when plants need nutes as the leaves go light green, so we give nutes and they go back to the nice dark green, now i giving bpn with every feed was not damaging the plant or giving me any nute burn, but when i tried feeding bpn every other feed on a test plant their was no difference between the plant fed bpn with every feed and the plant fed every other feed, so this suggests the plant is still getting enough nutes to thrive, so i tried every 3rd feed thinking id come across problems such as the leaves going light green or something nute def related, but i seen none of this, the plants grew the same as the plants fed every feed, or they was doing slightly better, id need to do more testing to be sure,

reps for the info though mate, im going to look into this flushing agent as i have seen several growers use it, so ill have a look around and a read and see what i can find out, thanks for the info,

ill have to give you reps when it lets me, i must of all ready gave you reps in the last few days cuz it says i got to spread the love before giving you more reps
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot Don :).. I'm glad my input somehow helps your experiments :grinjoint:
BTW, I think that's an excellent experiment you're doing with trying different feedings (every other / every 3rd), you'll find that magic spot real soon :) No need for reps brotha, I'm just glad my noob input somehow helps :)
 
just a little trick i learned from a farming program.

if we assume our plant is at 100% humidity (i think they are actually around 90%)

you divide the dry weight by the wet weight to work out the current average humidity.

in your example (9/21)*100=42% humidity.

so i think a good way to dry/cure *might* be to weigh your bud at harvest. and simply jar it up when it loses half its weight.

it needs testing, but im sure we can work it out =)

soysawce said:
I weighed that piece and its 9 grams now. I squished it and it puffed back up. Should I jar them now?
Click to expand...

soysawce said:
i weighed this piece and it weighed 21 grams.
Click to expand...

edit: if anyone can work out a simple math like that based on 90% humidity please share. im not sure how to do it.
 
iSmokes said:
I'm good with these but I'm not sure what you mean :)
If you can reword what you need in that equation I might be able to help :grinjoint:
Click to expand...

That part I can handle!
 
basically. every plant has an inherant humidity level. i think our plant runs at around 90% humidity inside itself.

this is coming from 2 angles.

1st is to be able to snip a bud from the plant and weight it..based on its wet weight we should be able to mathmatically reduce its humidity conted, thus revealing a close aproximation to its dry weight.

2nd is to be able to weigh an entire plant, still in its pot and be able to estimate its dry yeild using a similar equation.

for example, my new hydroganic grow will be using pots that all weigh between 1575 and 1600 gramms, we can expect that at least 60% of the plant weight is 'non usable' like stalk and leaves.

so lets say i have grown a plant and in its pot it weights 3kilo.

we minus 1600 grams because of the pot
leaving 1400 grams.
we now times that by .4 (removing the unusable from the calculation)
leaving 560 gramms.
this is wet bud.
lets say we want an end product with 50% humidity and we are starting with one that has 90% i guess we could times that 560 by .9 and that should give us the weight of water inside.
504g of water. then i guess we half that number then put back the missing part we lost just doing the .9

so 252+56=308 gramms of dry bud estimate for a plant in my pot weighing a total of 3 kilo at the day before harvest...


thats basicly the kind of formulae's im trying to get hold of...could make things a hell of a lot easier to do the guesswork.
 
For some reason i cant upload photos there is no browse file button haha ill upload them as soon as i see it appear haha.

Bought more seeds guys!
What i ordered:
Dutch Passion Taiga Autoflowering
Dutch Passion Auto Mazar
Dutch Passion Think Different Auto

Freebies:
Delicious Seeds Critical Jack Herer
Samsara Seeds Automatic Ultraviolet
G13 Labs Diesel Auto
G13 Labs Blue OG
G13 Labs White Lavender

Awesome deal on att right now spend 30 euro and get all these free. Also going to grab a hps in a couple weeks . Once all these autos are done and grown i will grow the photoperiod ones and clone etc etc.
 
soysawce said:
For some reason i cant upload photos there is no browse file button haha ill upload them as soon as i see it appear haha.

Bought more seeds guys!
What i ordered:
Dutch Passion Taiga Autoflowering
Dutch Passion Auto Mazar
Dutch Passion Think Different Auto

Freebies:
Delicious Seeds Critical Jack Herer
Samsara Seeds Automatic Ultraviolet
G13 Labs Diesel Auto
G13 Labs Blue OG
G13 Labs White Lavender

Awesome deal on att right now spend 30 euro and get all these free. Also going to grab a hps in a couple weeks . Once all these autos are done and grown i will grow the photoperiod ones and clone etc etc.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a plan buddy! congrats on the seeds, the mail man is your santa now :laughtwo:
I have little experience with Dutch passion, Delicious, and Samsara >> they were all great, every seed germed and every seed autoflowered. So, just a little reassurance I guess :grinjoint:
 
GiGaBaNE said:
basically. every plant has an inherant humidity level. i think our plant runs at around 90% humidity inside itself.

this is coming from 2 angles.

1st is to be able to snip a bud from the plant and weight it..based on its wet weight we should be able to mathmatically reduce its humidity conted, thus revealing a close aproximation to its dry weight.

2nd is to be able to weigh an entire plant, still in its pot and be able to estimate its dry yeild using a similar equation.

for example, my new hydroganic grow will be using pots that all weigh between 1575 and 1600 gramms, we can expect that at least 60% of the plant weight is 'non usable' like stalk and leaves.

so lets say i have grown a plant and in its pot it weights 3kilo.

we minus 1600 grams because of the pot
leaving 1400 grams.
we now times that by .4 (removing the unusable from the calculation)
leaving 560 gramms.
this is wet bud.
lets say we want an end product with 50% humidity and we are starting with one that has 90% i guess we could times that 560 by .9 and that should give us the weight of water inside.
504g of water. then i guess we half that number then put back the missing part we lost just doing the .9

so 252+56=308 gramms of dry bud estimate for a plant in my pot weighing a total of 3 kilo at the day before harvest...


thats basicly the kind of formulae's im trying to get hold of...could make things a hell of a lot easier to do the guesswork.
Click to expand...

I see where you're trying to go with this GiGa. I think the first part is practically impossible (weighing pots with whole plants). I mean, it IS possible, but there's so many variables it would drive a mathematician insane :laughtwo:. Remember, in yield we care for grams, and everything weighs a lot of grams when you're measuring Kg's. Water has a density of 1g/cc, 1cc=1ml, so 1ml of water (I'm sure you know how littttle that is) will weigh 1g. So even drops of water will make any equation incredibly inaccurate.
The last part of your quest, however, is very plausible. By the last part, I mean weighing the wet trimmed buds, and guessing a dry weight. This wouldn't be much guessing, it's going to be spot on if we know the initial water content and the final water content we seek. To get the initial water content one needs to take a sample bud, weight it to the nereast .00 (2 decimals to be more accurate), and then completely dry it out. Dry it to a crisp. This bud will have to be sacrificed to figure out how much water this plant tissue is able to hold. Let's say it drops by a factor of 10, which means it held 90% water. This means the buds on this plant are holding 90% water. The number is not going to be a whole number, I'm sure it'll be like 87.52% or something. Anyway, when we get this number, our second task is to figure out what number we seek. And by that, I mean what's the best water content for fine dried bud? (not crisp dried, our desired "dried") Let's say it's 40% like you assumed. That means we're looking to lose 50% of the weight in water (90-40=50). This is the magic number, the % that we're seeking to lose.
Now, as soon as we get that %, we need to figure out the actual mass of water that we want to lose. Say we have 200 grams of wet bud. That means we're looking to lose 100 grams of water (50%). Now we get to the important equation. Depending on conditions (temperature and humidity), water will have a certain rate of evaporation. This can be done through basic equations of thermodynamics. I'm not going to go into thermodynamics because it will get extremely boring for anybody who's not familiar with this subject, feel free to PM me if you want to go in detail about this. With this final equation, one will be able to predict exactly how long it will take the bud to go from 90% to 40%, + predict almost exactly how much the bud will weigh :).
+ with all this in mind, the thickness of the buds will make a difference because less surface area will mean lower rate of evaporation. I think it's fairly impossible to determine the exact surface area of bud (because of all the curves and curls in calyxes (spelling?)) without an accurate digital scanner. All in all I think an equation will make rather precise tool for prediction. Not accurate, but precise, there's a difference. Precise can be converted to accurate by following a simple calibration curve. I'm a science lover, be it math, biology, chemistry, anything LOL! I'm afraid people are already bored, so if you want some more explanation or just want to talk more about it, let's go to my journal or PM me :). I'd be more than happy :grinjoint:
 
PS: Precise means you get numbers really close to each other time after time you repeat the experiment. Accurate means that the number you're getting is close to the true value. A calibration curve is what helps us change our precise measurements to a more accurate value (i.e closer to the true value).
 
iSmokes said:
I see where you're trying to go with this GiGa. I think the first part is practically impossible (weighing pots with whole plants). I mean, it IS possible, but there's so many variables it would drive a mathematician insane :laughtwo:. Remember, in yield we care for grams, and everything weighs a lot of grams when you're measuring Kg's. Water has a density of 1g/cc, 1cc=1ml, so 1ml of water (I'm sure you know how littttle that is) will weigh 1g. So even drops of water will make any equation incredibly inaccurate.
The last part of your quest, however, is very plausible. By the last part, I mean weighing the wet trimmed buds, and guessing a dry weight. This wouldn't be much guessing, it's going to be spot on if we know the initial water content and the final water content we seek. To get the initial water content one needs to take a sample bud, weight it to the nereast .00 (2 decimals to be more accurate), and then completely dry it out. Dry it to a crisp. This bud will have to be sacrificed to figure out how much water this plant tissue is able to hold. Let's say it drops by a factor of 10, which means it held 90% water. This means the buds on this plant are holding 90% water. The number is not going to be a whole number, I'm sure it'll be like 87.52% or something. Anyway, when we get this number, our second task is to figure out what number we seek. And by that, I mean what's the best water content for fine dried bud? (not crisp dried, our desired "dried") Let's say it's 40% like you assumed. That means we're looking to lose 50% of the weight in water (90-40=50). This is the magic number, the % that we're seeking to lose.
Now, as soon as we get that %, we need to figure out the actual mass of water that we want to lose. Say we have 200 grams of wet bud. That means we're looking to lose 100 grams of water (50%). Now we get to the important equation. Depending on conditions (temperature and humidity), water will have a certain rate of evaporation. This can be done through basic equations of thermodynamics. I'm not going to go into thermodynamics because it will get extremely boring for anybody who's not familiar with this subject, feel free to PM me if you want to go in detail about this. With this final equation, one will be able to predict exactly how long it will take the bud to go from 90% to 40%, + predict almost exactly how much the bud will weigh :).
+ with all this in mind, the thickness of the buds will make a difference because less surface area will mean lower rate of evaporation. I think it's fairly impossible to determine the exact surface area of bud (because of all the curves and curls in calyxes (spelling?)) without an accurate digital scanner. All in all I think an equation will make rather precise tool for prediction. Not accurate, but precise, there's a difference. Precise can be converted to accurate by following a simple calibration curve. I'm a science lover, be it math, biology, chemistry, anything LOL! I'm afraid people are already bored, so if you want some more explanation or just want to talk more about it, let's go to my journal or PM me :). I'd be more than happy :grinjoint:
Click to expand...


we are on exactly the same page!!! the thing i saw about humidity said to dry the plant matter to a chrisp to measure its fully dry weight.

a few things

i can measure my pots and i do. bear in mine i use 2l bottles as pots, i poke them full of holes to make them air pots (yes they all have identical size and amount of holes :rofl:) i then pour in exactly 1 litre of gravel ( i spend time vibrating it and pressing it to optimise the fit), i then add a fixed amount of transition layer. which for these pots is 1x peat pot chopped up to act as a particle barrier covered by an exactly level cup of perlite, these are then sunk into water and then pulled out to drain. i then mix fresh moist compost straight from the bag with 20% perlite and place in 5 slightly pressed and level cups of this into the pot. i then weigh those pots as they have the EXACT moisture level desired for the grow. i had 2 pots com in at around 1575 gram and the rest was 1590 to 1600. thats a pretty tight control. also unlike a lot of dwc style grows where you pull the top off and your left with a plant in your hand with its roots dangling everywhere, my containers are self contained seperate to their water, so you can quite litterally pull them out of the tank and just stand them on the floor with no care taken at all(except a reasonably clean floor...we dont want munchie crumbs in the water, lol).


and the 2nd thing is...i believe tha magic number is 62%...thats what these weed curing humidity bags are set at.

just imagine how much energy someone like James the Green could save if he could just shovel a pile of dope on a table, rapid air dry it so that its average weight meant an overal 62% humidity, then just stick it in an air tight room to average out for a day or two =D thats the theory anyway, lol.
 
A thousand will definitely give you good norms and averages to go by LOL :laughtwo: !!
That's a really good theory with the fast air drying. I bet it would have implications though :) you know of course..
GiGa I have to say that's a very nice medium for your ladies. I wasn't sure what you meant when you said hydroganics and I didn't ask because I thought it would be a stupid "noob" question lol. But I see what you mean by that and I think it's great! The gravel gives the roots something to grow on - around - and through, while keeping the 2L stable by weighing it down. :bravo: Also, very well thought with the transition medium to allow the roots to adjust as they work their way down :thumb:.. I'm still new to this, but your medium sure sounds like a winner to me.
Great GiGa, nice to meet you, now I have one more journal to go through :lot-o-toke:
 

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