Need a lot of help starting to feel like a total loser

[PopPop65]

This is my 3rd attempt at my first grow. I started with Auto Lowryder seeds. I have a 48x36x70 grow tent with a fan up above inside and a fan on the floor. I have a 4inch vent fan going out the top. I have 2 led grow lights by Briignite Brq 600watt full spectrum LED grow lights with Samsung LM281B LEDs it says 600 watts but only draws 60 watt. I keep the lights so I have the recommended 600 ppfd at the top of my plants. I am feeding with Foxfarm liquid nutrients trio, Bloom city Cal Mag, i also use as needed Bloom City Ph Down, espoma soil acidifer, a chlorine remover.

My first seedings popped up then fell over and died in a week. With friendly people here helping I was able to learn the tap water here has a pH of 7.2. So I got the pH down and things looked better on my 2nd set of seedings they filled the 3 inch pots with roots in no time so I put them in gallon grow bags they took off growing for a week then they stopped growing and in a weeks time curled up and died. I ask for help here and again people were a huge help. Found out I was not using the right nuts and the pH of my Potting soil was 7.4 and the chlorine in my water was high so I added the soil acidifer and the new nuts and remove the chlorine from the tap water and started my 3rd set of seeds for my first ever grow. Things were really looking good I had my first male and 2 female plants yes I wanted seeds because I am going through them so fast. I had my first buds start to show then just like before they put on the breaks and stopped growing 5 days ago. Yesterday I saw specs all over the leaves I thought it was pollin but no it's part of the leaves. I will post pics of the plants. To make all this worse I have for the first time ever a plant pop up next to my back door outside. I dug it up and it's now in a 35 gallon grow bag. I put it in Bagged Potting soil from Homedepot it's growing just fine 3 feet high but can't tell sex yet.

I am hoping someone will know what I am doing wrong to keep having my grows inside fail. With our neighbors we don't want to be growing outside even though we leagly can.

 

[PopPop65]

One of my girls look real pale they use to be a deep dark green now they look like they have covid lol

 

[PopPop65]

I am pretty sure it's not leaf septoria the spots are too small and never touch. I have looked with a magnifying glass for bugs from top to bottom both sides of leafs and see no bugs or eggs. I am stumped

 

[Buds Buddy]

I could make an educated guess, but I'd rather ask someone who knows for sure. Have you asked @Emilya for help ?
If anyone can point you in the right direction it will be her.

 

[Emilya Green]

looks like a bad case of spider mites to me

 

[bluenoserjoe]

God morning @PopPop65 . I will take a swing at this. Looks to be early stages of root rot. The white spots I am not so sure about. You said that you were using grow bags but that pot in the pics. looks to be plastic. Are there plenty of drain holes and what are the temps. like where you are growing?

 

[Buds Buddy]

God morning @PopPop65 . I will take a swing at this. Looks to be early stages of root rot. The white spots I am not so sure about. You said that you were using grow bags but that pot in the pics. looks to be plastic. Are there plenty of drain holes and what are the temps. like where you are growing?

Not sure about the Root Rot.... never had it. Temps do look to be high from the curled leaf edges. I was also thinking mites but thought it could possibly be a def. It's those couple of black spots on the leaves that I haven't seen before.

 

[bluenoserjoe]

Not sure about the Root Rot.... never had it. Temps do look to be high from the curled leaf edges. I was also thinking mites but thought it could possibly be a def. It's those couple of black spots on the leaves that I haven't seen before.

I see the black spots, could be a shadow, not sure. I have never had mites so wasn't the first thing I thought about. Hope the OP responds with a few more pics.

 

[PopPop65]

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts I am lost here for sure.. as for pots Yes on the 3rd try I potted them up in 3 gallon pots from the 3 inch pots. No grow bags this time. The bottoms have a 1/4 inch ridge gap crossing the bottom of the pot and 1/2 holes plenty of air flow they drain good but being 3 gallon with 30% peat moss 20% coco cor 30% perlite and 20% Black MO compost they drain good but the water they do retain wants to stay forever. They do not dry out as fast as they do outside under the sun. They start looking short on nuts before the pots are completely dry. I do have a 12 inch fan on the floor of the tent that blow right up these pots It's only 3 inches from the fan to the soil in the pots. I did that trying to dry out the soil.
I have looked all around the plants and do not see any type of mites, bugs or webs no sign of bug eggs.
It's been hot the average temperature in the tent has been 85 day 78 nights but I have had a few 95 day 85 night days a week ago. Average humidity is between 58 to 74% usually 66%.

 

[PopPop65]

Sorry it took so long to respond to your questions I made this postb3 hours ago as I was going to sleep woke up and saw a bunch of replies. Well going back to sleep for a few more hours.

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi @PopPop65 and welcome to the forum.

The spider mites are not the whole problem. The black spots are an unknown, but very scary. I would be thinking about mold or something else evil that is growing on those leaves. Get to the bottom of that, fast. But the biggest problem seems to be that you assumed that your soil pH was so out of whack that you needed to adjust it. First of all, the soil's base pH is set high for a very good reason, to provide pH drift. It was NOT a problem and was set up there on purpose. You have acidified your soil, probably making it much better suited to growing orchids than pot. You have eliminated the drift and greatly reduced the effectiveness and availability of your nutes.

This is a mess. I am not even sure you can grow pot in acidified soil... it will certainly be a challenge. The spider mites are not going to help the situation at all, alone they can wipe out a plant. You may have to consider this one a learning moment and be ready to start over. I would also take a critical look at some of the advisors you have had so far. You seem to be working on some misinformation and bro-science. It may surprise you that chlorine will not hurt your plants and actually is one of the trace elements needed by our plants to complete its nutrient profile. The ONLY time you need to worry about chlorine is when you are trying to use natural microbes to organically grow your plants... and not even in all cases.

Early on, before you start feeding with synthetic nutes, pH is not even an issue. Early vegetating plants primarily need Nitrogen, and it is available across such a wide swath of pH that normal tap water and normal soil will not stop it from being mobile. Generally, the only time you need to worry about pH is when you start feeding with scientifically engineered synthetic nutes, that demand a certain narrow pH range for the nutes to become available to the plant. Right here in the beginning, pH is not so much of an issue. When you do start applying your Fox Farm nutes, you will need to carefully pH both your feeding and your water only passes, since the proper way of doing this is to feed/water/feed/water all through the grow. You didn't mention having pH up... for that will always be necessary when you add feed to your water because the acidic nutes will drive the pH of that mix way down toward the acidic. So this begs the question... are you pH adjusting the fluid after everything is mixed into it and you are getting ready to apply it to the soil?

Then, the Fox Farm nutrients themselves. This is a very scientific grow "system" that must be used as recommended on their widely published feeding charts. Not only the feedings, but also the flushing has to be done as recommended, with the exact mix of nutrients recommended for that week of the grow. You have to follow this precisely, and trust the system, and if you do, the nutrient system will work amazingly well.

Lastly, the watering. There IS a proper way to water this weed. Overwatering is THE most common way of killing this plant, especially in the early stages.

And while I was typing this, you posted another clue. You only have 20% compost and no soil. You have acidified a soilless grow, and you are treating it like soil. No wonder we are having problems. All this talk about soil, and its not even soil. And then you have another, sitting by the back door I think, that is in good old home depot soil. Now my head is spinning. You have a hydro grow (acidified) and a soil grow (maybe also acidified) ... I am confused. Maybe we can sort this all out when you wake up.

Trying to understand and help...

 

[Dwight Monk]

When learning to me it's best to do the old KISS method (Keep It Simple Stupid), otherwise messing with advanced medium building methods is like trying to learn Trig before you grasp basic Algebra and basic Geometry (or in this case trying to grow in soil and grow in a soiless medium at the same time in same container, you can't have best of both worlds or you can if you get lucky somehow but it will fight you probably the whole way). Without naming specific brands pick a good bagged potting soil and one of the basic 2 or 3 part Nutrient lines to start with that Cannabis growers use (lots out there and varies on where you are to what is easily available). As they have already made a "balanced" system that will work, as they would like you to buy their product and you won't if it don't work. Once you have a successful grow you can try and change things trying to get to "optimal" (advanced techniques) or you can stick with the KISS stuff, as even not even close to optimal finished product is better than not even getting close to any finished product.

Folks here will help you out and get you squared away, sure not everyone here agrees but their methods will work (same can't be said for some of the FB groups or some of the YT experts where the Bro Science runs rampant, and yes those methods might work if the variables line up with the Stars but not very likely or consistently ).

Does seem to potentially be a pest problem that will need to be figured out or least made sure there isn't one. But picking either a basic soil or soiless medium and a basic nutrient system will be easier for folks that know that specific method to help you out on the right direction to having a successful full cycle with finished product grow.

 

[SmokingWings]

Interesting thread.

Yes, it does look like a Mite or insect problem starting. A real good chance that they cannot be seen yet because their population is just getting started.

@PopPop65, the ideas that @Dwight Monk brings up make a lot of sense, especially going with the KISS Principle to get started.

With friendly people here helping I was able to learn the tap water here has a pH of 7.2.

and the pH of my Potting soil was 7.4

How were you able to find out what the pH was? The methods you used to test for the pH of your water and then the soil are good things to learn how to do. But sometimes the numbers throw us off and distract us from understanding what we are actually seeing.

and the chlorine in my water was high

Not sure how you could find out that the chlorine level was high in your water.

I have to go along for the most part with @Emilya when she mentions you might be working on some misinformation and bro-science. I figure it is more likely you were doing what I was doing several years ago and was reading about all types of growing methods and trying to use the best of the best at the same time. Doing that can lead to confusion on our part and the plants end up not growing as well as we know they can.

 

[SmokingWings]

I see the black spots, could be a shadow, not sure. I have never had mites so wasn't the first thing I thought about. Hope the OP responds with a few more pics.

A shadowing makes sense. I have seen shadows make it look like something is on a leaf just like glare caused by a camera flash will make some leaves look like they have Powdery Mildew or other molds. I looked over the photos and it does like the black spots are showing up on several leaves, each leaf angling off in a different direction.

It is very possible that the black spots are something commonly called "Black Spot". Black Spot is caused by a fungus. Real easy to treat it now while it is just a few spots, especially if the spots are just on the tops of the leaves. Any decent fungicide should take care of it in one application, especially the organic ones that contain sulfur. It is better and easier to do something about that now while waiting till the other problems are figured out.

 

[jaybirdz]

The white leaf spots could be edema, to verify check the underside of the leaf for raised bumps or blisters.

I'd try to figure out how to get your tent temp/humidity levels down to ~75F and 40-50% and read Emilya's articles on proper plant watering. Focus on allowing the soil to complete a wet-dry cycle before watering.

Where is your tent located?

The first pic does look like spidermites, maybe because its slightly blurry.

 

[PopPop65]

Hi @PopPop65 and welcome to the forum.

The spider mites are not the whole problem. The black spots are an unknown, but very scary. I would be thinking about mold or something else evil that is growing on those leaves. Get to the bottom of that, fast. But the biggest problem seems to be that you assumed that your soil pH was so out of whack that you needed to adjust it. First of all, the soil's base pH is set high for a very good reason, to provide pH drift. It was NOT a problem and was set up there on purpose. You have acidified your soil, probably making it much better suited to growing orchids than pot. You have eliminated the drift and greatly reduced the effectiveness and availability of your nutes.

This is a mess. I am not even sure you can grow pot in acidified soil... it will certainly be a challenge. The spider mites are not going to help the situation at all, alone they can wipe out a plant. You may have to consider this one a learning moment and be ready to start over. I would also take a critical look at some of the advisors you have had so far. You seem to be working on some misinformation and bro-science. It may surprise you that chlorine will not hurt your plants and actually is one of the trace elements needed by our plants to complete its nutrient profile. The ONLY time you need to worry about chlorine is when you are trying to use natural microbes to organically grow your plants... and not even in all cases.

Early on, before you start feeding with synthetic nutes, pH is not even an issue. Early vegetating plants primarily need Nitrogen, and it is available across such a wide swath of pH that normal tap water and normal soil will not stop it from being mobile. Generally, the only time you need to worry about pH is when you start feeding with scientifically engineered synthetic nutes, that demand a certain narrow pH range for the nutes to become available to the plant. Right here in the beginning, pH is not so much of an issue. When you do start applying your Fox Farm nutes, you will need to carefully pH both your feeding and your water only passes, since the proper way of doing this is to feed/water/feed/water all through the grow. You didn't mention having pH up... for that will always be necessary when you add feed to your water because the acidic nutes will drive the pH of that mix way down toward the acidic. So this begs the question... are you pH adjusting the fluid after everything is mixed into it and you are getting ready to apply it to the soil?

Then, the Fox Farm nutrients themselves. This is a very scientific grow "system" that must be used as recommended on their widely published feeding charts. Not only the feedings, but also the flushing has to be done as recommended, with the exact mix of nutrients recommended for that week of the grow. You have to follow this precisely, and trust the system, and if you do, the nutrient system will work amazingly well.

Lastly, the watering. There IS a proper way to water this weed. Overwatering is THE most common way of killing this plant, especially in the early stages.

And while I was typing this, you posted another clue. You only have 20% compost and no soil. You have acidified a soilless grow, and you are treating it like soil. No wonder we are having problems. All this talk about soil, and its not even soil. And then you have another, sitting by the back door I think, that is in good old home depot soil. Now my head is spinning. You have a hydro grow (acidified) and a soil grow (maybe also acidified) ... I am confused. Maybe we can sort this all out when you wake up.

Trying to understand and help...

Emilya thank you thank you thank you your information is Eye opening.
Yes I am trying to grow in a soiless medium. Trying to use the mix to hold up.the roots and retain a little water.

I have NOT been testing my nutes after they are mixed just before I apply them. I see now why that would be important. I also have not been test the water after it's been through the pots I will start doing that now too. I am following the recommendation from Fox Farm on how much nutes to mix in a gallon of water and how often to feed and I have been watering between each feeding. Information I can not find on my nutes is how much of the mix do I apply a pint a quart or a gallon. I also can not find information on how much water it use each watering.

Somehow I missed the part about flushing out the plants I thought that was something that was only done if we have a problem and right before harvest to get the nutes out of the plants. Yesterday I did surgery on 2 plants I made a mix of neem oil and drops of dish soap. I used saran wrap to protect my buds I wrapped them tightly with saran wrap making it water tight. I sprayed the plants both sides of leafs. Then I flushed out both pots with 2 gallons each natural water and put them in full sun to dry out. Here are pics of the same plant leafs shown in my first post.

 

[Emilya Green]

So in a soilless medium, hydro rules apply. You also should have gotten the hydro version of the fox farm nutes. all you have to do is a search on google for fox farm feeding schedule and you should be able to easily find the hydro chart. The charts are usually measured in tsp/gallon or ml/liter and you should probably water until you get about 20% runoff, so you can help wash the salts away with every watering. Also be aware that your pH target has changed... your range is now 5.5-6.1 and you should shoot for around 5.5-5.8 for a good wide range on the nutes. Flushing is a thing with these nutes, and you have to flush the salts away periodically... the chart will tell you when to do it. Note that the flush at the end is at the 6 week point, not the very end. You can not flush nutrient tastes out of the plant and a flush at the very end is pointless.

 

[PopPop65]

The white leaf spots could be edema, to verify check the underside of the leaf for raised bumps or blisters.

I'd try to figure out how to get your tent temp/humidity levels down to ~75F and 40-50% and read Emilya's articles on proper plant watering. Focus on allowing the soil to complete a wet-dry cycle before watering.

Where is your tent located?

The first pic does look like spidermites, maybe because its slightly blurry.

Jay my tent is in a very big room for a house. The room is 22 feet x 55 feet long 12 foot ceiling. Back form early 1920s until late 1950s it was a grocery store with 5 bedrooms above it and a 1 story house connect to the side. We use it for washer and dryer and playroom when the kids lived here it has no insinsulation and has never had air-conditioning I have 3 box fans to keep air moving in the room. No.way to control the temperature now Humidity I can take control over.

I read about people growing all over the world with temperatures reaching over 100 degrees day and night for weeks at a time and they grow pot. So I am sure the high temperature in my tent should not stop me from growing.

 

[PopPop65]

Jay my tent is in a very big room for a house. The room is 22 feet x 55 feet long 12 foot ceiling. Back form early 1920s until late 1950s it was a grocery store with 5 bedrooms above it and a 1 story house connect to the side. We use it for washer and dryer and playroom when the kids lived here it has no insinsulation and has never had air-conditioning I have 3 box fans to keep air moving in the room. No.way to control the temperature now Humidity I can take control over.

I read about people growing all over the world with temperatures reaching over 100 degrees day and night for weeks at a time and they grow pot. So I am sure the high temperature in my tent should not stop me from growing.

I may need to adjust witch type of cannabis I plant to handle the 75 to 95 temperatures in my tent.

 

[PopPop65]

So in a soilless medium, hydro rules apply. You also should have gotten the hydro version of the fox farm nutes. all you have to do is a search on google for fox farm feeding schedule and you should be able to easily find the hydro chart. The charts are usually measured in tsp/gallon or ml/liter and you should probably water until you get about 20% runoff, so you can help wash the salts away with every watering. Also be aware that your pH target has changed... your range is now 5.5-6.1 and you should shoot for around 5.5-5.8 for a good wide range on the nutes. Flushing is a thing with these nutes, and you have to flush the salts away periodically... the chart will tell you when to do it. Note that the flush at the end is at the 6 week point, not the very end. You can not flush nutrient tastes out of the plant and a flush at the very end is pointless.

Emilya you are my hero ❤ I have learned so much from you. Thank you for the help you gave me and the help you provide all newbies. I read your paper on watering plants. Wow I did not know how much I didn't know about watering.

For all new growers if there is one thing I can advise you for your first grow it is STAY OFF YOUTUBE I was mislead so much on YouTube most of the bad advise I got was suggesting I had to have this or that in order to grow and they are nice enough to give me a link to buy it so they can make a dime.

Bottom line all I want to do is grow some pot that is fit for smoking. And I prefer to grow Inside to keep neighbors happy. I didn't want any fancy system or have to have a chemist degree to grow. I was not looking to grow soilless.

I just want to buy seeds germinate them put them in pots feed and water them tending to the ladies needs and be rewarded with some quality smoke.
But I have been mislead in so many different directions is seam impossible now. I don't mind spending what is needed to do that. I just needed a simple buy this do this and you will have a good grow. Unfortunately for me I looked in the wrong places and got taken a little by a few people who were more into putting money in thier pockets than helping someone out. I probably have everything I need already just have to learn how to use it correctly. I do know I will now be able to water my plants in a way to grow a healthy root ball.instead of having tap roots going straight to the bottom of my pots.