Jon's Dedicated Fruity Pebble Cookies Grow Plus The Mystery Plant

[Jon]

Hi @Bill284, good afternoon good sir. Wanted to let you know I am conducting a little controlled experiment regarding the coco watering thing we talked about. Since our discussion I really got curious.

So today marks the fourth time I have intentionally not watered the coco girls in the big tent. Last time was about two weeks ago. I can see and feel from the outside of the pot easily where the dry out line is on these at any given moment. By 6 pm we'll be almost to the bottom, and by morning we should be bone dry. Right now they are praying like beasts. Like they always seem to. Let's see what they look like tomorrow at 6 am. I will mix the 5 gallons of feed tonight for the morning and water them at wake up.

As we discussed, I'm wondering if letting even coco have a day of air occasionally is a good thing despite everyone getting so hyper about keeping it constantly wet. Also want to see what the prayer angle is when they're bone dry at wakeup.

Not much of an experiment really, just checking out the landscape a little bit....

 

[Azimuth]

Also want to see what the prayer angle is when they're bone dry at wakeup.

Now  that should be an interesting picture. Maybe @Bill284 shouldn't look until we give it the all clear.

 

[Bill284]

Hi @Bill284, good afternoon good sir. Wanted to let you know I am conducting a little controlled experiment regarding the coco watering thing we talked about. Since our discussion I really got curious.

So today marks the fourth time I have intentionally not watered the coco girls in the big tent. Last time was about two weeks ago. I can see and feel from the outside of the pot easily where the dry out line is on these at any given moment. By 6 pm we'll be almost to the bottom, and by morning we should be bone dry. Right now they are praying like beasts. Like they always seem to. Let's see what they look like tomorrow at 6 am. I will mix the 5 gallons of feed tonight for the morning and water them at wake up.

As we discussed, I'm wondering if letting even coco have a day of air occasionally is a good thing despite everyone getting so hyper about keeping it constantly wet. Also want to see what the prayer angle is when they're bone dry at wakeup.

Not much of an experiment really, just checking out the landscape a little bit....

My last harvest before the move was GG.
I was away several times house shopping up north etc.
It was the worst looking crop I have had in a long time.
Harvest was well below par.
So that was my drought experiment.
Check the pics in PP thread.
I'm think one or two nights will be fine , un noticeable.
But let's see what happens.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Jon]

Morning Wake Up after Dry

Ok @Bill284 and @Azimuth, this little experiment is now defunct. The girls woke up visibly droopy (for this tent). It may not look too bad in the picture, and it isn't, but definitely a difference to the downside. We won't be letting them dry out from now until the end, I've seen what I wanted to see. My conclusion after doing it three times in veg and once now during the stretch:

- Once in a while you can get away with it in veg and it may even help. All three times I let them get dry in veg the plants seemed to respond well, and there may have been a slight growth spurt (tiny) in response. Didn't bother them in the slightest.
- Don't let them get dry in flower at all. They'll just droop and be pissed at you. This is how they looked this morning and apparently the stretch is not the time to do this.

At the end of the day, all it does is give you a day to screw up and forget to water in veg without repercussions. Useless. You were right, @Bill284. I don't need any more data than this.

Here's how the tent looked at wakeup with all four plants bone dry. You can see all the large fans have taken a bit of a dive and the colas aren't standing at attention as they do.

Wakeup dry.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

Here's what the typical cola looked like individually. Some might not be unhappy with this. I am. It's not how these plants are. No more drying out coco. Lol.

typical dry cola.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

Here's another canopy shot to show you how nice and even the left side of the tent is and how unruly Fulvia is being, determined to mess it all up. Lol. This was taken right after I watered all four plants, so the droop is even more extreme. By noon they'll all be standing at attention.

post dry.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

And to end on a happy note, here's our Jack Herer auto enjoying her place in the tent. She's so excited to get to hang out with REAL pot plants.

Jack Herer in the tent.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

 

[Kanno26]

Hi @Jon, congratulations on being nominated for the April Diary

 

[Jon]

Hi @Jon, congratulations on being nominated for the April Diary

Thank you @Kanno26, it is an honor always to be nominated by your peers for any award. Winning is less important to me than the nomination. Good thing too, cuz I'm getting dusted this month.

 

[Azimuth]

Nice experiment. Now you know. I like to do the same thing. Read the research and bro science but still prove it to myself in my environment if I'm not convinced.

Often, most often in fact, the advice given is correct and I learn a lesson that cost me time, money, part of a harvest, whatever.

But now it's part of my experienced knowledge, not just some theory I read about somewhere.

And this lesson doesn't seem to be all that costly for you, at least to my experimental eye.

Good on you for your failed experiment. I learn more from those than I do from stuff that works out.

 

[Jon]

Nice experiment. Now you know. I like to do the same thing. Read the research and bro science but still prove it to myself in my environment if I'm not convinced.

Often, most often in fact, the advice given is correct and I learn a lesson that cost me time, money, part of a harvest, whatever.

But now it's part of my experienced knowledge, not just some theory I read about somewhere.

And this lesson doesn't seem to be all that costly for you, at least to my experimental eye.

Good on you for your failed experiment. I learn more from those than I do from stuff that works out.

@Azimuth, that is all very well said and I agree with every word. Thanks for the kind words. There are many things I accept as truths, either due to actual hard science, my own repeated observation of the same thing, or testing of potential bro science as in this case. If anyone had shown me or I found a scientific paper telling me why you should not let them dry I likely would not have done this. But all I've ever heard was don't do it. My thought was, coco, soil, or any non-hydro medium it's got to benefit the roots once in a while to dry all the way out. We already know it's good to do in soil. Why not coco? Anyway, you're right, no negative impact whatsoever and now I can not have to revisit that thought anymore. Yay.

 

[Jon]

Titan
Day 51
Flowering Update

Here are three different buds from three different levels on Titan from this morning. Do you guys notice the almost complete lack of frost? I do. This plant also has no odor whatsoever, just smells like a plant. I guess these two things are related, lol. I have had late frosters before, and I'm going to say this girl qualifies. You can see she's just beginning to toss a tiny bit now in the second picture. Noted. Watermelon WeddingCake = late froster/late smeller.

 

[Jon]

Spent Soil Plant

Good morning, @FelipeBlu, hope this day finds you well. I was thinking about this little Spud Bud plant in comparison to the Mystery Plant and what happened with her.

The Mystery Plant began exactly the same way in the same spot. I dug her up and put her in a 3 then up potted her to a 5. When I put her in the 3 she went outback on the lennai and to a dark spot at night, just as I did with my other outdoor plants. Then she started to flower - one day she suddenly had budlets. So then I up potted her to the 5 and tossed her in the vegging big tent at 24/0, thinking she was an auto. Only as a photo she went to reveg, and now she's in flower again obviously. Ok, there's the brief historical recap on the MP.

What I'm thinking about is the light cycle with respect to flowering and what may happen here. When the MP was outside and went to flower, the natural light cycle was 12/12 or less, maybe 11/13. Pre solstice. Therefore (I now know, lol) she went to flower naturally when the plant decided it was mature enough. Well, the light cycle now here is not even really 13/11 yet.

What I'm wondering is if this plant may just decide to go into flower soon, as she is close to the same point in maturity as the MP was when she turned.

That would frankly be awesome. I'm also thinking she may go to flower then reveg by herself as the light cycle changes. That would be not so cool, I'd have to just leave her for the new owners when I moved. Lol.

Any thoughts?

 

[Jon]

One of my best buds from PA is in Florida and coming by today for a visit, my boy Ryan from Pittsburgh. It will be the first time anyone from PA has ever seen my setup, other than the end result. When I last saw Ryan I had never grown one pot plant (I haven't seen him in the two years since I began growing). He isn't going to believe what he's seeing. Most of my friends aren't grower so don't really have the perspective all of us do here. I can't wait to see his reaction. He is one of the few PA friends I have who has never tried any of my weed. Lmao.

 

[Bill284]

One of my best buds from PA is in Florida and coming by today for a visit, my boy Ryan from Pittsburgh. It will be the first time anyone from PA has ever seen my setup, other than the end result. When I last saw Ryan I had never grown one pot plant (I haven't seen him in the two years since I began growing). He isn't going to believe what he's seeing. Most of my friends aren't grower so don't really have the perspective all of us do here. I can't wait to see his reaction. He is one of the few PA friends I have who has never tried any of my weed. Lmao.

Hope you have a great day Mucker.
Good people have good friends.
Here I'm psychic this is a pic of his reaction


Stay safe
Bill

 

[Bill284]

Morning Wake Up after Dry

Ok @Bill284 and @Azimuth, this little experiment is now defunct. The girls woke up visibly droopy (for this tent). It may not look too bad in the picture, and it isn't, but definitely a difference to the downside. We won't be letting them dry out from now until the end, I've seen what I wanted to see. My conclusion after doing it three times in veg and once now during the stretch:

- Once in a while you can get away with it in veg and it may even help. All three times I let them get dry in veg the plants seemed to respond well, and there may have been a slight growth spurt (tiny) in response. Didn't bother them in the slightest.
- Don't let them get dry in flower at all. They'll just droop and be pissed at you. This is how they looked this morning and apparently the stretch is not the time to do this.

At the end of the day, all it does is give you a day to screw up and forget to water in veg without repercussions. Useless. You were right, @Bill284. I don't need any more data than this.

Here's how the tent looked at wakeup with all four plants bone dry. You can see all the large fans have taken a bit of a dive and the colas aren't standing at attention as they do.

Wakeup dry.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

Here's what the typical cola looked like individually. Some might not be unhappy with this. I am. It's not how these plants are. No more drying out coco. Lol.

typical dry cola.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

Here's another canopy shot to show you how nice and even the left side of the tent is and how unruly Fulvia is being, determined to mess it all up. Lol. This was taken right after I watered all four plants, so the droop is even more extreme. By noon they'll all be standing at attention.

post dry.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

And to end on a happy note, here's our Jack Herer auto enjoying her place in the tent. She's so excited to get to hang out with REAL pot plants.

Jack Herer in the tent.jpg

• Jon
• Apr 27, 2022

Couple things I've noticed.
During veg I had 50 or so a day to water.
Given my health there absolutely were days no one got fed.
Repercussions were minimal for the most part.
Larger girls ready for the flower room were not happy but recovered without showing signs of damage.
In flower not the same. Nutritional requirements during that stage of growth are majorly different.
A day missed in flower was hugely detrimental.
Damage was permanent and effected the end result.
I can't prove this but I'm sure without their daily requirement of nutrients they uptook what ever was available.
Bottled nutrients leave unwanted matter in the root zone.
Trying to uptake that matter wasn't good for my GG.
Just an observation no actual proof so don't beat me up on that one.
Here is something else I never mentioned to you.
Coco is hydrophobic Right? Go figure.
You let it dry in the pot when you water it again it says fek you.
Just shoots right through, you have to keep doing it over and over until you get it wet.
So when you have an 11' jher in coco you are nothing but a caterer, chef and dam cabana boy.
Think about that outside, hehe plus 20 more and 50 inside
Good for you for trying it out yourself.
There are lots of things I take for granted that I have never fully tested.
I still want to do the double darkness after stretch experiment we talked about.
Just before I decided to move so never got to that one.
Keep chipping away it's the best way to learn.

Take care my friend.
Bill

 

[Jon]

Couple things I've noticed.
During veg I had 50 or so a day to water.
Given my health there absolutely were days no one got fed.
Repercussions were minimal for the most part.
Larger girls ready for the flower room were not happy but recovered without showing signs of damage.
In flower not the same. Nutritional requirements during that stage of growth are majorly different.
A day missed in flower was hugely detrimental.
Damage was permanent and effected the end result.
I can't prove this but I'm sure without their daily requirement of nutrients they uptook what ever was available.
Bottled nutrients leave unwanted matter in the root zone.
Trying to uptake that matter wasn't good for my GG.
Just an observation no actual proof so don't beat me up on that one.
Here is something else I never mentioned to you.
Coco is hydrophobic Right? Go figure.
You let it dry in the pot when you water it again it says fek you.
Just shoots right through, you have to keep doing it over and over until you get it wet.
So when you have an 11' jher in coco you are nothing but a caterer, chef and dam cabana boy.
Think about that outside, hehe plus 20 more and 50 inside
Good for you for trying it out yourself.
There are lots of things I take for granted that I have never fully tested.
I still want to do the double darkness after stretch experiment we talked about.
Just before I decided to move so never got to that one.
Keep chipping away it's the best way to learn.

Take care my friend.
Bill

Thanks so much @Bill284. Your observations here basically support with much more evidence the conclusion I came to. Also, when I watered today it DID take longer and it DID go right through at first. I kept at it and they took the entre 5 gallons for a change instead of the usual around 4. Absolutely correct again. Like I said, I get it now. Just had to try it once for myself to find out for me. You know how it is. Glad it was not an experiment I pushed in the least, and also happy my experience level is now where I can do this kind of thing and learn without fucking my grow up. Don't worry, there will be no more dry days. Lol. And MY GOD that had to be SO much work. Insanity.

THANKS!!!!!

 

[Jon]

Changes to Gorillatown!!

This is one of the rare times when I'm going to straight up just tell you guys I came up with and have implemented an idea that even I can see is a great one.

I was beginning to get concerned about the fan game in the Gorillatown. The way it was set up I had fabulous coverage (air flow from the big boy oscillating fan) up top, and *meh* coverage underneath in terms of air flow. It was okay that way to start.

But now the stretch has them tall enough canopy-wise that even with the big boy oscillator on it's lowest setting all the colas are getting blasted every time the air turns their way. It was a bit too much, and they're not done stretching yet.

Ideally, I thought, the majority of the air should come from below. Wouldn't that be better until there's buds up top that need constant moving air? As it leafs up underneath and the tent fills up more and more, the reality of the "two separate RH zones" above and below canopy level pronounces itself more and more. I expected this, it always goes like that. My thinking is, if I could somehow get a ton of air moving up at all the plants, it would not only improve the RH underneath, but would also be mixing the top and bottom zones of environment more so than otherwise. This should, in theory, lead to a slightly more uniform environment in the tent as a whole, which simply would have to be better.

Once I came to that conclusion it was a simple matter of implementation. Well, not so simple really. Lol. What I did was I relocated the big boy oscillator to UNDERNEATH the plants, laying horizontally, and still oscillating. Wasn't sure I could pull it off as it is a bit tricky. The fan head is so heavy that unless it stays above a certain angle it won't oscillate and just gets stuck. I had to experiment with the lift point until I found the right spot. Also had to actually determine said lift point, as it had to be a point where it wouldn't interfere with the turning of the head (oscillation). There's only one spot to do it with, lol. But find it I did. And get it to stay solidly I also did, via a variety of positioning, bricks for weight on the base to keep the head up, and a length of 2x4 to keep it where it sits. This was necessary due to the fact that the head of the fan outweighs the base by a mile. Two bricks worth, actually, lol.

What I now have is a massive amount of oscillating air from underneath that hits all the plants and keeps them all jiggling up top. Doing it this way, given the amount of stem and undercarriage cleanup I've done, I am able to max the fan, since it doesn't really hit anything for a while. It's fricking GLORIOUS. I may not even need upper fans later in flower it's so damn good.

Even a blind pig gets an acorn once in a while!!!

Here's some front and back side pics to display the above, along with a non-fan canopy shot and a picture of the undercarriage cleanup on the Jack Herer. Sorry for the smaller pictures.

 

[FelipeBlu]

What I'm thinking about is the light cycle with respect to flowering and what may happen here. When the MP was outside and went to flower, the natural light cycle was 12/12 or less, maybe 11/13. Pre solstice. Therefore (I now know, lol) she went to flower naturally when the plant decided it was mature enough. Well, the light cycle now here is not even really 13/11 yet.

What I'm wondering is if this plant may just decide to go into flower soon, as she is close to the same point in maturity as the MP was when she turned.

If you’re getting less than 14 hours of sun, she could definitely start flowering - and then will reveg once the daylight gets long enough. If you want her to stay in veg, you could give her 15 minutes of light (really just a light bulb) at some point to break up the extended dark hours.

 

[Jon]

If you’re getting less than 14 hours of sun, she could definitely start flowering - and then will reveg once the daylight gets long enough. If you want her to stay in veg, you could give her 15 minutes of light (really just a light bulb) at some point to break up the extended dark hours.

I understand all of that. That's easy. Here's a bit harder....what I want to do is exactly the opposite. I WANT her to go to flower. It would be perfect. But in 60-70 days we will definitely get at least to 14/10. So the question is, short of moving her, which I have nowhere to move her to btw, how can I keep her IN flower and NOT revegging, staying in the same location?

 

[Bill284]

Thanks so much @Bill284. Your observations here basically support with much more evidence the conclusion I came to. Also, when I watered today it DID take longer and it DID go right through at first. I kept at it and they took the entre 5 gallons for a change instead of the usual around 4. Absolutely correct again. Like I said, I get it now. Just had to try it once for myself to find out for me. You know how it is. Glad it was not an experiment I pushed in the least, and also happy my experience level is now where I can do this kind of thing and learn without fucking my grow up. Don't worry, there will be no more dry days. Lol. And MY GOD that had to be SO much work. Insanity.

THANKS!!!!!

I hooked the back yard hose to an indoor tank an pump system inhad existing.
Made it bearable at least.
But you know what it's like when you get into the zone and you working away at everyone it's enjoyable.
So I didn't mind.
I had tricks to make everything easier on myself.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Jon]

I hooked the back yard hose to an indoor tank an pump system inhad existing.
Made it bearable at least.
But you know what it's like when you get into the zone and you working away at everyone it's enjoyable.
So I didn't mind.
I had tricks to make everything easier on myself.

Stay safe
Bill

Wow, yeah you told me that before, thank god. Lol. Can't imagine the work without that.

I've learned so much about growing in coco relatively quickly that I can barely imagine using soil by choice again unless I feel like doing a Geo grow, which I will at some point since I have tons of it. Lol. Any nuted grow is coco for the forseeable future. Soil is like watching paint dry.

LmAo.

 

[Bill284]

Wow, yeah you told me that before, thank god. Lol. Can't imagine the work without that.

I've learned so much about growing in coco relatively quickly that I can barely imagine using soil by choice again unless I feel like doing a Geo grow, which I will at some point since I have tons of it. Lol. Any nuted grow is coco for the forseeable future. Soil is like watching paint dry.

LmAo.

Right.
I'm going to get shit for this but I laugh at soil.
I wouldn't touch it ever again if I wasn't growing outside.
It's just too much work outside to run coco.
Otherwise growing in coco is great to watch.
Ever day you can measure the growth.
And omg the guessing with soil is a nightmare.
Should I water ? Should I feed ? Should I flush ? Does she need more of this or more of that?
Why put yourself through that.
Especially for beginners yeiks those poor guys.
Come out the door with a bag of fox farms thinking everything is going to be great then they end up here with their hair on fire.
Beating themselves on the head with a YouTube video trying to put it out.
Now thats funny. sorry red neck comedy on 24hr lol.
But I feel for these poor guys spend a fortune and get fek all.
Coco feed feed feed oh yeah feed some more.
It's simple and I have total control.
With the microbes and fungi it's just a pleasure to watch them just explode.
Well I better shut up hehe
Talk soon I imagine.
I'm going out to check on my mini split.

Stay safe
Bill