Exceptionally High Feco Yeilds: Straw Hat Notes
- Thread starter Maritimer
- Start date
Alrighty then! I was aware that things are not all as I've read in the past, even recent past. About a year and a half ago I watched Frenchy Cannoli, a hash maker, say to wait until trichs are very amber for the best hash for outdoor growing! Well that didn't make sense with current knowledge of indoor growing. That is what we all have come to measure with right? Clear = not ready but maybe ready and have racy consequences. Milky = ready. And Amber = less thc and more sleepy feel.Ahoy Shedski
I was gonna post to your thread understanding you and your audience might challenge my positions.
The conversation about trichome color and post drought harvesting needs to be revisited. Something is missing. I will provoke your thinking by telling you there is a good chance we are all wrong. Amber this, milky that. It’s all bullshit. Maybe not all bullshit, just mostly bullshit. Just like well intentioned, but foolhardy practice of intentional defoliation. More bullshit. Got to run but I will be back.
Put on your thinking caps if you're up to the task, then go ahead and call me out. No hate mail please.
That's what I got. I seem to think there's some difference between outdoor and indoor growing that changes how the plant works( reacts to the light available). That's where you come in. Post Drought differences now huh?
Looking forward to the rundown on why its all bullshit.Ahoy Shedski
I was gonna post to your thread understanding you and your audience might challenge my positions.
The conversation about trichome color and post drought harvesting needs to be revisited. Something is missing. I will provoke your thinking by telling you there is a good chance we are all wrong. Amber this, milky that. It’s all bullshit. Maybe not all bullshit, just mostly bullshit. Just like well intentioned, but foolhardy practice of intentional defoliation. More bullshit. Got to run but I will be back.
Put on your thinking caps if you're up to the task, then go ahead and call me out. No hate mail please.
- Thread starter
- #164
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
Frenchy is hitting on most his cylinders. I love how he describes the great hash ball of Mali. And how nobody in hash producing countries smoke resin less than one year old (at least). Dude has zero botanical background, so we went to the same classes. But if you listen to what he is saying it is clear, the best hash comes from amber trichomes.
LOL, that's a crack in the arguments foundation. Let's keep swinging the hammer. Try this one next.
"The best buds are higher up the plant because they are closest to the light/sun". Wrong again Buford
or this stuff "defoil the leaves covering flowers". Try harder, wrong again.
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- #165
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
"The top buds are best because they are closest to the light".
We Says
It is not so much the sunshine, as the higher flowers benefit from the hydraulic tension that allows the uploading of nutrients. The higher up the plant a flower is positioned the more it will benefit from the hydraulic tension pulling the molecules from the roots to the very tips. The same holds true from the perspective of hormonal synthesis and regulation. The proteins utilized in the synthesis of essential oils require the hormones that regulate it to be transported through the same hydraulic network. Again, you will see more dominant effects of hormonal regulation the further away from the root zone.
@Emilia, are you busy?
tbc
We Says
It is not so much the sunshine, as the higher flowers benefit from the hydraulic tension that allows the uploading of nutrients. The higher up the plant a flower is positioned the more it will benefit from the hydraulic tension pulling the molecules from the roots to the very tips. The same holds true from the perspective of hormonal synthesis and regulation. The proteins utilized in the synthesis of essential oils require the hormones that regulate it to be transported through the same hydraulic network. Again, you will see more dominant effects of hormonal regulation the further away from the root zone.
@Emilia, are you busy?
tbc
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- #166
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
not all bull, mostly bull
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- #167
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
Now about those leaves blocking your flowers from the light we think it needs.
The trichomes are storage tanks for synthesized essential oils and are not used in the production of energy (photosynthesis) like that which occurs within the foliar matter. The flower bracts are made from floral matter, not foliar matter. The cells making up the flower do not participate in photosynthesis. The trichomes do not require direct light to "ripen" to amber. The oxidation and time ripen the surface trichomes we stress over. This would probably account for less than 10% of a flower's total cannabinoid content. The rest you can't see as they are buried in the floral matter.
tbc
The trichomes are storage tanks for synthesized essential oils and are not used in the production of energy (photosynthesis) like that which occurs within the foliar matter. The flower bracts are made from floral matter, not foliar matter. The cells making up the flower do not participate in photosynthesis. The trichomes do not require direct light to "ripen" to amber. The oxidation and time ripen the surface trichomes we stress over. This would probably account for less than 10% of a flower's total cannabinoid content. The rest you can't see as they are buried in the floral matter.
tbc
Got some trichome pics up in my thread on flip day 72, and you can see that the tops are much more amber than the buds that grew in the shaded areas, so that's further proof that outside, the sun will change the color of the trichs irrespective of the "ripeness" of the flowers.
I never believed that the flowers needed direct light to grow and @bobrown14 has always told us about translocation of nutrients, but size seems directly related to flower placement on the plant as you said. Not just the hydraulic tension, but because the top colas are the ones most likely to catch the pollen on the wind, so the plant puts its energy into making those the biggest...y'know, apical dominance and all.
I never believed that the flowers needed direct light to grow and @bobrown14 has always told us about translocation of nutrients, but size seems directly related to flower placement on the plant as you said. Not just the hydraulic tension, but because the top colas are the ones most likely to catch the pollen on the wind, so the plant puts its energy into making those the biggest...y'know, apical dominance and all.
I haven't dug around much on this topic but surely someone somewhere has done the science: analyzing cannabinoid content of clear, cloudy, and amber trichomes to let us know when THCa becomes CBNa.
LOL! Don't @ me bro.
Does it? Or do folks who make hash prefer more couchlock in their smoke? Does anyone get/crave that uppy clear/cloudy-trichome sativa high from the amber-triched hash?
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- #169
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
You have it. That, I think is precisely what is at play there when Frenchy says amber is best the hash. When your tolerance to cannabis rises with chronic use of concentrates, it takes that strong couch effect to think your catching a buzz. If you are high all the time, getting high requires more and more ...
Not sure of your source, but the reason plants are green is chlorophyll. Plants are good at not wasting potential energy. Buds and the sugar leaves are green, they contain chlorophyll, end of story. The plant does not make chlorophyll to have it sit around and do nothing. Any part of the plant that is green has chlorophyll in it, buds, sugar leaves, bracts, etc. Even the sepals of a male flower have chlorophyll. They may not have the same concentration as the leaves, but it is functioning chlorophyll and it does contribute to energy for the plant/flower. I've looked at the inside of bud tissues under a microscope and you can SEE THE CHLOROPLASTS. Marijuana is wind pollinated, as with many wind pollinate plants it doesn't waste energy on showy flowers, nectar, nectar guides, pheromones, etc.
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- #171
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
Ahoy Phyto,
I wish we chatted more often. Sounds like we could hash out a few notions and everybody would benefit.
I agree there is chlorophyll in the green parts. I do not think the reactive component plays a significant role in energy production at this stage of the plant's life we are talking about. But I agree there exists the ability to contribute slightly to overall plant energy production. In active bloom and post bloom when we trigger the species survival through the application of drought, the wind pollinated plant doesn't waste energy maintaining turgid postures either, and that energy is repurposed. During drought induced species survival, the transpiration will cease with the closing of the stomata brought on by rising levels of ABA. The rising levels of ABA simultaneously trigger the JA Pathways, signaling the production of essential oils has become the wind pollinated plants only reason to produce energy. The oils are produced in effort to save the seed stock from drying out, with the hope of species survival.
Stay in touch my friend. I love to learn, and it sound like you have plenty of knowledge you could share.
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- #172
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
My truck's name is Ester.
She is 22 years old.
Yes, I love her.
Yes, there is a gun in it.
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- #173
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
Ahoy there!
Help needed.
We have a crew of Cookies Jack Monster Clones that needs trimmed. Anybody know where you cut these silly looking things when topping? I seen it once in a picture play by play but can't find it now.
Help needed.
We have a crew of Cookies Jack Monster Clones that needs trimmed. Anybody know where you cut these silly looking things when topping? I seen it once in a picture play by play but can't find it now.
Depends, I guess, in what your plans are. I like the Quadlining process so that leaves 4 nodes to work with. On a seedling you'd snip just above node 5, remove the two lower nodes and train out the top two nodes (3 and 4). On a seedling each node produces two opposing brances so it makes the symmetry easy. With clones, since the nodes are no longer opposite but rather alternate, I like to pick a couple that are reltively close together and use that for training.
If you are just topping to produce more branches and not planning any particular training method, whatever the top node is left after you trim will want to be the dominant leader and will tend to go off in the direction it is facing from the stem, but that will also encourage more than one to want to break free.
Is this what you are asking, or something else?
If you are just topping to produce more branches and not planning any particular training method, whatever the top node is left after you trim will want to be the dominant leader and will tend to go off in the direction it is facing from the stem, but that will also encourage more than one to want to break free.
Is this what you are asking, or something else?
You post a picture and I'll show you where I'd top it!
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- #176
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
Locasynthesis Lecture; Maritimer et-al 2023.
Ahoy @Azimuth,
Please, don't eat the Daisy's.
I do not have a specific reference that will identify what I am going to describe, but it is my way of understanding the plant. I call it locasynthesis from the Latin phrase locales snythesis meaning localized synthesis. In this theory the flower will be provided the essential energies and resources required to fulfill its reproductive responsibilities thru a localized network of synthesizers. We are not only describing photosynthesis, as we will discuss in a second, but hormonal synthesis as well.
The plant has a Genetic Regulatory Network (GRN) of complex nature that operates similar to human central nervous system (CNS) except in a plant the entire GRN is written in DNA code and can be disassociated while remaining functional. When you cut off a cutting for cloning the entire mother plants GRN becomes disassociated from the cuttings and both parts retain fully functional GRN systems. The cutting becomes a separate, but identical organism. The instant the scissors closed, from one came two.
From One came Two individual, but identical organisms striving for the same genetically controlled goal of reproduction. The code written in the DNA of both organisms telling the plants they must fulfil the responsibility of reproducing the species. The developmental stages of life neatly planned out in an orderly fashion. From the development of gonads, thru the production of flowers capable of conducting life, the DNA codifies everything that should happen.
The instant the scissors closed the cutting was fully equipped with its own GRN. Suddenly, but seamlessly assuming complete control over the young cultivar. In that instant, sensory cells are reporting the injury and the cutting’s GRN has began remixing the hormonal balance to allocate synthesis of complex proteins and cells beginning the wound healing process. The cutting will begin building root cells, and the demand for vegetative growth will come in time to produce adequate foliage for energy production.
Locasynthesis is directly responsible for the transmission of life unto the cutting. Like the ghost copy of the DNA code, locasynthesis is the creator’s mechanism for allowing a leaf to simultaneously be happily providing photosynthesis to the mother plant while it remains attached to it, meanwhile capable and functionally able to instantly become independent from the mother plant synthesizing its own hormonal homeostasis as required. The ability to provide photosynthetic energy to the Mother plant whilst simultaneously providing the same upon separation unto the cutting is an example of locasynthesis. There is a great deal we still do not fully understand about locasynthesis and that plays directly into my hesitation regarding defoliation of cannabis during flower.
Too much going on already to force her into abortive senescence.
Nine Toed Hippie
Well-Known Member
Just one? Thanks for your service Devil Dog.
My truck's name is Ester.
She is 22 years old.
Yes, I love her.
Yes, there is a gun in it.
NTH
- Thread starter
- #178
Maritimer
Well-Known Member
So that would imply those cells are similar to stem cells in that they are able to morph into whatever is called for in the particular circumstance? They have to already be there in the cutting since the plant doesn't know the scissors are coming and then it's too late. So the act of cutting must stimulate the plant to kick into survival mode and repurpose certain cells to regrow roots and kick the process off??Locasynthesis Lecture; Maritimer et-al 2023.
Ahoy @Azimuth,
Please, don't eat the Daisy's.
I do not have a specific reference that will identify what I am going to describe, but it is my way of understanding the plant. I call it locasynthesis from the Latin phrase locales snythesis meaning localized synthesis. In this theory the flower will be provided the essential energies and resources required to fulfill its reproductive responsibilities thru a localized network of synthesizers. We are not only describing photosynthesis, as we will discuss in a second, but hormonal synthesis as well.
The plant has a Genetic Regulatory Network (GRN) of complex nature that operates similar to human central nervous system (CNS) except in a plant the entire GRN is written in DNA code and can be disassociated while remaining functional. When you cut off a cutting for cloning the entire mother plants GRN becomes disassociated from the cuttings and both parts retain fully functional GRN systems. The cutting becomes a separate, but identical organism. The instant the scissors closed, from one came two.
From One came Two individual, but identical organisms striving for the same genetically controlled goal of reproduction. The code written in the DNA of both organisms telling the plants they must fulfil the responsibility of reproducing the species. The developmental stages of life neatly planned out in an orderly fashion. From the development of gonads, thru the production of flowers capable of conducting life, the DNA codifies everything that should happen.
The instant the scissors closed the cutting was fully equipped with its own GRN. Suddenly, but seamlessly assuming complete control over the young cultivar. In that instant, sensory cells are reporting the injury and the cutting’s GRN has began remixing the hormonal balance to allocate synthesis of complex proteins and cells beginning the wound healing process. The cutting will begin building root cells, and the demand for vegetative growth will come in time to produce adequate foliage for energy production.
Locasynthesis is directly responsible for the transmission of life unto the cutting. Like the ghost copy of the DNA code, locasynthesis is the creator’s mechanism for allowing a leaf to simultaneously be happily providing photosynthesis to the mother plant while it remains attached to it, meanwhile capable and functionally able to instantly become independent from the mother plant synthesizing its own hormonal homeostasis as required. The ability to provide photosynthetic energy to the Mother plant whilst simultaneously providing the same upon separation unto the cutting is an example of locasynthesis. There is a great deal we still do not fully understand about locasynthesis and that plays directly into my hesitation regarding defoliation of cannabis during flower.
Too much going on already to force her into abortive senescence.
Interesting stuff, but I'm not going to lie, much of it above my pay grade.
And how does this all relate to whether or not to defoliate to expose bud sites?
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