Winging It In Winter By The Window: Soil Auto Grow

[Azimuth]

I don’t want to take off the shabby leaves because I think it spreads the problem to higher leaves if those aren’t taking the hit. I might be wrong who knows.

You would be correct. There are mobile, semi-mobile and non-mobile elements. Some, like nitrogen are mobile so if there is not enough to go around the plant will take from the lowers and give it to the upper growth nodes. So, if you don't solve the problem by giving more N in this case, the plant will just start taking it form the next leaf in line.

 

[Carmen Ray]

You would be correct. There are mobile, semi-mobile and non-mobile elements. Some, like nitrogen are mobile so if there is not enough to go around the plant will take from the lowers and give it to the upper growth nodes. So, if you don't solve the problem by giving more N in this case, the plant will just start taking it form the next leaf in line.

Azi do you think I need to give them some N? I've been giving calmag but maybes I must give them a foliar spray with some kelp which has N in it?

I was going to say about a week! Regardless in a week they’ll be ready, just maybe not as much amber as you want in a perfect world. But who knows? Every plant is different. She might get there in three days. About the yellowing leaves, I’m with you. I keep them as long as they are viable. This still are a bit to my eyes.

Thank you. I snipped the brown calcium deficient lowers and I am pretty sure the N thing in the uppers became worse. Lesson learnt.

They never seem to do what we would like.

Theres two harvest windows. When they are ready, and when we are. Occasionally they correlate.

When you say couch lock, to me at least, it means you will need to run harvests a lot deeper than you would to minimise it. Or select target strains and genetics, to get there faster.

In my view those breeder supplied harvest days are only a guide, and a bit of an unreliable one. Great for comparing which ones will finish earlier, or later, terrible for accuracy.

Cold climate and couch lock will make them even more unreliable.

Tickles me to count the times I and others have thought 1 to 2 weeks to go, and then in 1 to 2 weeks looks like it still going to be another fortnight.

Sometimes you have time to wait, some times not. Dont be too hard on yourself if you miss the " ideal" window being a bit early.

Thank you Deev, I see what you mean about the guides being somewhat generic and unreliable. Thank you for reminding me not to be hard on myself about the timing. I think by Wednesday next week I must have have the plants up-potted and in place, which gives them 10 days to veg before they go to natural light cycle... tight but hopefully enough.

 

[Trala]

I’m actually wondering if your light is too close or too powerful for the veg state. I discovered by accident my plants were droopy and depressed because of my light. Since moving the light right up high, my leaves are back to smiling, their little green hands raised drinking in the light.

 

[InTheShed]

The plants are looking great even if they do give you a lot to talk about! I'd take off some of the larf on the Lavendar Best but just the lowest 6" or so at this stage. And on the photos, remember that stripping the lowest growth will force the plant to move growth to the tops, which should give you longer branches and more room to train.

I think you're two weeks from couchlock territory on the stunning Carmel King, and I don't see a conflict with upcanning the photos in the meantime.

 

[Carcass]

I think it spreads the problem to higher leaves if those aren’t taking the hit. I might be wrong who knows.

Even if you are wrong, (and I don't think you are) leaving the funky leaves on till the plant discards them isn't going to hurt anything...might be a little ugly, but I've always said- they've got to get a bit ugly before they can get pretty...

Next feed will be tomorrow or should I drought?

I hope you're better at it than I am- I was going to drought one of my autos, but when the time came, I couldn't do it...it just didn't seem right...
Maybe one of these days, but not this time....

 

[Carmen Ray]

I’m actually wondering if your light is too close or too powerful for the veg state. I discovered by accident my plants were droopy and depressed because of my light. Since moving the light right up high, my leaves are back to smiling, their little green hands raised drinking in the light.

That's interesting. I have just read someone else in another thread say similar, so it's good to know that may well be a factor. I've moved them again and hopefully they improve condition. Thank you Tra.
I've also given them a foliar spray of kelp extract earlier and for that I moved them out of the light.

The plants are looking great even if they do give you a lot to talk about! I'd take off some of the larf on the Lavendar Best but just the lowest 6" or so at this stage. And on the photos, remember that stripping the lowest growth will force the plant to move growth to the tops, which should give you longer branches and more room to train.

Ok, tomorrow will be a busy day. I will up-pot if they look up to it. Removing larf makes me nervous but I will give it a bash... and taking the branches off I will do. I am going to move the vegging plants down onto the bench and raise the light to move the Lavender Best up to the table. CK will have to go on books to meet the height of the Lavender Best. It should be doable. Thank you Shed.

I think you're two weeks from couchlock territory on the stunning Carmel King, and I don't see a conflict with upcanning the photos in the meantime.

Great... sorted... it's all organized in my head.

I couldn't do it...it just didn't seem right...

Yeah, I don't know if I will either...

leaving the funky leaves on till the plant discards them isn't going to hurt

Today I gave one of the brown leaves on the woody base of the Lavender Best a yank because she surely is past that, but it wasn't coming loose, so I left that too. They are her first leaves. It doesn't look nice, but hey. I hope the kelp extract might help with the vegging pair. Thank you Carcass.

 

[Azimuth]

I've also given them a foliar spray of kelp extract earlier and for that I moved them out of the light.

 

[Carmen Ray]

Oh my word, these plants stink. It's a putrid flower smell, decay. I don't like it. It's cloying. I just spent some time sniffing my plants. It's a clash of smells and the Caramel King smells like over-ripe blooms, sickly sweet. Together they smell like a garbage truck. I will check the trichomes when the lights are back on and possible chop. I know it's not couch lock time yet, but I can't deal with this stench. It's worse when the lights go off. They don't like it. I think I might take the CK down today.... maybe... maybe not... definitely maybe lol. Phew they really don't like it when the lights go out.

 

[Carmen Ray]

She just is not ready. The stink has gone now that the lights are back on. They dislike the interrupted light cycle. I think it really stresses them.
I couldn't bring myself to delarf the LB. The larf that is there will be smokable. The only way I could justify it is if I cut the lower two branches off altogether which I didn't want to do since they have grown good enough buds already and I don't want to risk losing all that.
I also did not up-pot. I discovered that I am missing one plant saucer and without that the bags will leak all over the place. I'm too skint atm to buy another one... different priorities, so they will have to wait for the chop. What I did do is I cut the lower branches off both vegging plants. They have perked up significantly since the foliar feed and the little bit of water to their feeder roots.

 

[InTheShed]

Maybe the kelp spray makes them stink? I've never used it but you did just spray them so I thought I'd ask.

 

[Carmen Ray]

Maybe the kelp spray makes them stink? I've never used it but you did just spray them so I thought I'd ask.

No I don't think so. I don't spray the flowering ones, only the photoperiods once because their leaves are showing distress. The kelp extract doesn't smell. It's heavy perfume coming from the plants and their scents clash. I think they object to the lights going out every few hours because that is when I notice it more. I like the smell of the caramel king on its own... the other one is weird. I can't quite put my finger on it.

 

[Carcass]

and the little bit of water to their feeder roots.

If they're stinking more than usual, they might need more water- my plants stink about 3x worse (or better, depending how you look at it) when they need water.
And they start stinking long before the leaves start to droop, so they don't have to "look" thirsty for them to turn on the extra stink...
Since I have no carbon filter on the box, I'm very "in touch" with the smells they produce (as is Mrs.C. )
Just a thought...

 

[Carmen Ray]

If they're stinking more than usual, they might need more water- my plants stink about 3x worse (or better, depending how you look at it) when they need water.
And they start stinking long before the leaves start to droop, so they don't have to "look" thirsty for them to turn on the extra stink...
Since I have no carbon filter on the box, I'm very "in touch" with the smells they produce (as is Mrs.C. )
Just a thought...

Hi Carcass, lol yes I am familiar with the challenge you and Mrs C have with the smells and I totally get it . I did give them water but can't remember if it was before or after lights out. I notice the smell more when lights are out so I think it stresses them, the off and on. I want to get your view on my grow space given that you have the practiced eye. I am worried that extending my canopies to pool noodles will make the plants too wide for the space. I up potted the Wedding Cake today and all of a sudden the space seemed to be inadequate for my plans. Especially since the Caramel King has at least a week left, possibly two, and the Lavender Best is two weeks behind her. I am wondering if they will fit. I have a fair amount of vertical space as I can raise the light. I can only raise the light when the autos are done though surely? What do you suggest I should do about noodles in the space and with the timing? Can I pull it off?

 

[Carcass]

Hi, Carmen- Sorry it took so long to get back to you, busy day around here...

I am worried that extending my canopies to pool noodles will make the plants too wide for the space.

That is a possibility, looks like you've got about as much space under that light as I have in my box- what I used to do when I grew 2 plants in the box was to train them in a rectangular shape, instead of a square-
That way, they'll fit side by side under the light, and more of the plant will be in the "good light".

My plants would end up roughly 12" wide by 22" long, so it was a little tight, but they'd both fit in the box.
And, since your plants have those drain pans under them, you won't really need a noodle- you can just tie the branches down, and hook the tiedown to the edge of the pans, either with clips of some kind, or, the easy way, just bend the wire under the pot edge...of course, this will only work if you leave the pots in the drain pans all the time, as opposed to taking them out of the pans to dump the runoff out. -Turkey basters, or a dollar-store super soaker can be used to pull the water out of the pans, leaving the plant in place....
Another thing to consider might be putting some spacers (boxes, bricks,books, etc) under the photo plants to get them a bit closer to the light- It may just look that way in the pics, but they look like they could be about 8" closer to the light....

Autos are looking good!

 

[Carmen Ray]

Hi, Carmen- Sorry it took so long to get back to you, busy day around here...

That is a possibility, looks like you've got about as much space under that light as I have in my box- what I used to do when I grew 2 plants in the box was to train them in a rectangular shape, instead of a square-
That way, they'll fit side by side under the light, and more of the plant will be in the "good light".

My plants would end up roughly 12" wide by 22" long, so it was a little tight, but they'd both fit in the box.
And, since your plants have those drain pans under them, you won't really need a noodle- you can just tie the branches down, and hook the tiedown to the edge of the pans, either with clips of some kind, or, the easy way, just bend the wire under the pot edge...of course, this will only work if you leave the pots in the drain pans all the time, as opposed to taking them out of the pans to dump the runoff out. -Turkey basters, or a dollar-store super soaker can be used to pull the water out of the pans, leaving the plant in place....
Another thing to consider might be putting some spacers (boxes, bricks,books, etc) under the photo plants to get them a bit closer to the light- It may just look that way in the pics, but they look like they could be about 8" closer to the light....

Autos are looking good!

Hi Carcass, no worries and thank you for your response I panicked a bit today and decided it was time for a premature harvest of the Caramel King. I can't operate in that small space with no wiggle room and the 20 L pots are too heavy for me to move around. I am filled with remorse when I see how immature the base of her buds are but I know that the reason was sound. More on that later.
I will try to train the plants. I don't have a lot of confidence that I know what I am doing. The closeness of the nodes on the main branch have been bothering me for a while. What will happen with those tiny branches that are coming up in a tuft? I'm glad I can use the drain pan to clip tie downs rather than doing pool noodles this time.
I am using cloths to wick the run-off from the drain pans, it's much easier than moving pots about. Good suggestion!
I'm not sure about the light Carcass. It was @Trala who suggested I distance them a bit earlier in the week and their condition improved after I did, so I don't know about putting them that much closer at this stage. I think I'd like to observe them for a bit in their new pots after I up-pot the Bruce Banner (now that I have a spare drain pan and space)

 

[Carmen Ray]

I panicked a bit today and decided it was time for a premature harvest of the Caramel King. I can't operate in that small space with no wiggle room and the 20 L pots are too heavy for me to move around. I am filled with remorse when I see how immature the base of her buds are but I know that the reason was sound. More on that later.

I came to the end of the road with CK today. I have another seed for another time and can always get more. I will do better next time and plan properly. Now I know to add some weeks to the breeder dates. I have learnt quite a lot about growing autos this time around and I look forward to my next grow.

Caramel King before harvest

224 g Wet weight (plus 111 g larf and trim)

The remains of CK

You can see how green the lower part of the bud is... oh well, next time I will do a better job.

Thank you you for your interest and I hope you have a great Friday!

 

[HashGirl]

Congrats on the CK harvest, Carmen. It looks like you'll get a decent yield despite this being your first grow. I only got 14 grams from my first 2 autos so you're already doing better than me. Can't wait to see your plants after you have a few grows under your belt.

 

[InTheShed]

Congratulations on your first indoor harvest! From an inauspicious start to that finish is an excellent result. And don't beat yourself up on the green lower part of the flower. It might have never gotten the same color (lower on the plant, fewer growth hormones, less light). And even if it had gotten color if you waited, the tops might have been well past their prime at that point.

So I say

 

[Trala]

Hi Carcass, no worries and thank you for your response I panicked a bit today and decided it was time for a premature harvest of the Caramel King. I can't operate in that small space with no wiggle room and the 20 L pots are too heavy for me to move around. I am filled with remorse when I see how immature the base of her buds are but I know that the reason was sound. More on that later.
I will try to train the plants. I don't have a lot of confidence that I know what I am doing. The closeness of the nodes on the main branch have been bothering me for a while. What will happen with those tiny branches that are coming up in a tuft? I'm glad I can use the drain pan to clip tie downs rather than doing pool noodles this time.
I am using cloths to wick the run-off from the drain pans, it's much easier than moving pots about. Good suggestion!
I'm not sure about the light Carcass. It was @Trala who suggested I distance them a bit earlier in the week and their condition improved after I did, so I don't know about putting them that much closer at this stage. I think I'd like to observe them for a bit in their new pots after I up-pot the Bruce Banner (now that I have a spare drain pan and space)

For me my light closer while my plants are in veg cause droop. I am now 97% sure.

This is in veg.

Light close - depressed looking plants much like your vegger

Light far - leaves up, plant happy

That’s just my experience. I have also found starting seeds under a regular LED house lamp a game changer. They help start a nice straight strong proud stem. Well I think it does.

 

[Carmen Ray]

Thank you HG. Well it's not my first grow, but it was my first under a light and my first auto I am pleased with the yield I must say. I thought there would be less!

For me my light closer while my plants are in veg cause droop. I am now 97% sure.

This is in veg.

Light close - depressed looking plants much like your vegger

Light far - leaves up, plant happy

That’s just my experience. I have also found starting seeds under a regular LED house lamp a game changer. They help start a nice straight strong proud stem. Well I think it does.

Thank you Tra. So far the color and perkiness of mine have improved since I distanced them further from the light. I also gave them the foliar feed and I've been giving them Calmag. They do seem happier I feel. I will share some pics once I have up-potted the Bruce Banner #2 but so far so good I think

Congratulations on your first indoor harvest! From an inauspicious start to that finish is an excellent result. And don't beat yourself up on the green lower part of the flower. It might have never gotten the same color (lower on the plant, fewer growth hormones, less light). And even if it had gotten color if you waited, the tops might have been well past their prime at that point.

So I say

Thanks Shed It's true, the plant was almost a solid mass of bud and there wasn't any way that the lower flower was getting any light. I took 111g of larf off the plant and 224g upper flower, so 50 % of the harvest weight was dense larf. Do you know if the trichomes on the lower flowers will potent or are they too green?