Asesino's Mystery Girl and Clones ScrOG - Coco Coir

[Asesino85]

Day 21/Day 5 Flower - 3 weeks in now and I don't expect the lone freebie female to stretch anymore. She is responding positively to the mass defoliation I did on day 15. Only time will tell how the colas will look but so far I am happy with it's nice bowl shape and that it is pretty even. I'm also anxious to see how these Ayahuasca clones will do. I don't think I am going to do much training to the littler of the two, maybe just spread it out a bit and let it grow. The other has already been spread out against the net and when it starts to stretch I will keep training it along the net for the next week. Then after that let it stretch the rest of the way vertical.

Bigger Ayahuasca

Little Ayahuasca

Freebie

Top view

I think the plants are loving the extra bit of light as well as the less is more strategy with my nute feedings. I am way more dialed in this time and they look really healthy with no signs of nute burn in the slightest. My goal this grow is to see some prettier, larger nugs. I know I will never have the huge ones using this net but thats not the goal. I do still think I can get some really nice nugs and I think I am on the right track this time. 40 nice colas would be lovely. Thats how many of budsights she has.

 

[TheBlaze]

Beautiful work Asesino. You have progressed very well in this hobby.

 

[pino0911]

Everything look great!! My plants are exploding!! Gonna do a update this evening. I think I have my signature figured out. M noticing that the 420 app is very user friendly. I have a easier go with pictures and my sig with the app and of course your help!! Again thanks and please continue with the journaling cause m learning every update. Ur da man!! Two thumbs up and if I had mare they would b io to. Lol

 

[hanibalctr420]

They look fantastic, Asesino! Thanks for sharing. If I can get my girls to look anywhere near as good I'll be damn happy

Quick update on my end - the whiteness is still there and it looks like theres at least a small bit on every branch apart from the very top ones that are just coming out. Reckon I should try the baking soda mix tonight?

I've also received the EC/PPM meter and have looked at some values with my feed today. In all honesty I know very little about EC and PPM so I don't know how useful these will be but maybe you can spot something.

Tap water values:
pH - 6.8
155 PPM
0.312 EC

Mixed with nutes:
pH - 5.9
380 PPM
0.76 EC

Runoff:
pH - 5.5
420PPM
1.3 EC

Note values could be slightly off but they're around that range. I figured maybe there's something I'm missing that can be deducted from these values which I have no idea about that can help the girls, let me know what you think

Edit: above was runoff for jo, I've just had a look at the runoff for MJ and that's somewhat different. 5.2 pH, 990ppm and 1.9 EC

 

[Asesino85]

They look fantastic, Asesino! Thanks for sharing. If I can get my girls to look anywhere near as good I'll be damn happy

Quick update on my end - the whiteness is still there and it looks like theres at least a small bit on every branch apart from the very top ones that are just coming out. Reckon I should try the baking soda mix tonight?

I've also received the EC/PPM meter and have looked at some values with my feed today. In all honesty I know very little about EC and PPM so I don't know how useful these will be but maybe you can spot something.

Tap water values:
pH - 6.8
155 PPM
0.312 EC

Mixed with nutes:
pH - 5.9
380 PPM
0.76 EC

Runoff:
pH - 5.5
420PPM
1.3 EC

Note values could be slightly off but they're around that range. I figured maybe there's something I'm missing that can be deducted from these values which I have no idea about that can help the girls, let me know what you think

Edit: above was runoff for jo, I've just had a look at the runoff for MJ and that's somewhat different. 5.2 pH, 990ppm and 1.9 EC

PPM is Parts Per Million and is a measurement of the mass of a chemical or contaminate per unit volume of water. In our case that is chemical and those chemicals are your nutes. The more nutes and things you put in your water the higher the PPM. Plants need different nutrients at different stages of their life but all the different things you put in your water adds up to your total PPM. If you overload or starve your plant of what it needs it will begin to either lockout nutrients because it cant hold anymore of that kind, or will start to consume stored nutrients in the plant. Thats when you see nute burn or yellowing of the leaves.

Here is a great thread with a long time grower who has produced awesome results - Cultivators Watering Thread

There is also a lot of good information on here and questions but really the first article that shows what week it is and how much PPM he uses is a good guide. I don't think you've done any transplanting yet (in the future start in a really small pot or solo cup with holes in it and transplant to a 3 gallon pot once after the roots have been established). You can see how 990 PPM is pretty high, especially for runoff. If you just fed them 380 then 990 was a combo of whatever you had been feeding them plus the 380. I would guess you were at 1100ish, maybe higher? Yikes! You should see that runoff number drop as you keep feeding and watering with the 380ish. Also your runoff should be 5.8 if you are giving them 5.8 so I'd keep the PH at 5.9 until your runoff is 5.7-5.8. You can swing back and forth from 5.6-6.0 but I wouldn't want my runoff too far out of that.

Were you mixing the nutes for each girl in a different bucket? Seems odd that they could have such different numbers. I'm not sure what nutrient line you are using but at this point focus on ratios. Just like anything in business the business you are buying from is going to tell you to consume more. They are way too high but often times the ratios are pretty close to keep your girls healthy. I run a 3 part line and I basically use a 6/2/1 ratio in flower. In veg it's pretty much flipped. In flower I just add a little bit more each week but keep the ratio the same. That raises the PPM proportionately so the plant doesn't experience lockouts or burns. If I see any signs of burning I lower the PPM for a few days. This is where learning to read the plant comes into play.

Did it look like the white powdery stuff spread? Did you wipe it off gently with just water? Any more spots or curling or anything? If it didn't look noticeably worse I might leave it another day again without the baking soda treatments. Picture helps!

 

[hanibalctr420]

PPM is Parts Per Million and is a measurement of the mass of a chemical or contaminate per unit volume of water. In our case that is chemical and those chemicals are your nutes. The more nutes and things you put in your water the higher the PPM. Plants need different nutrients at different stages of their life but all the different things you put in your water adds up to your total PPM. If you overload or starve your plant of what it needs it will begin to either lockout nutrients because it cant hold anymore of that kind, or will start to consume stored nutrients in the plant. Thats when you see nute burn or yellowing of the leaves.

Here is a great thread with a long time grower who has produced awesome results - Cultivators Watering Thread

There is also a lot of good information on here and questions but really the first article that shows what week it is and how much PPM he uses is a good guide. I don't think you've done any transplanting yet (in the future start in a really small pot or solo cup with holes in it and transplant to a 3 gallon pot once after the roots have been established). You can see how 990 PPM is pretty high, especially for runoff. If you just fed them 380 then 990 was a combo of whatever you had been feeding them plus the 380. I would guess you were at 1100ish, maybe higher? Yikes! You should see that runoff number drop as you keep feeding and watering with the 380ish. Also your runoff should be 5.8 if you are giving them 5.8 so I'd keep the PH at 5.9 until your runoff is 5.7-5.8. You can swing back and forth from 5.6-6.0 but I wouldn't want my runoff too far out of that.

Were you mixing the nutes for each girl in a different bucket? Seems odd that they could have such different numbers. I'm not sure what nutrient line you are using but at this point focus on ratios. Just like anything in business the business you are buying from is going to tell you to consume more. They are way too high but often times the ratios are pretty close to keep your girls healthy. I run a 3 part line and I basically use a 6/2/1 ratio in flower. In veg it's pretty much flipped. In flower I just add a little bit more each week but keep the ratio the same. That raises the PPM proportionately so the plant doesn't experience lockouts or burns. If I see any signs of burning I lower the PPM for a few days. This is where learning to read the plant comes into play.

Did it look like the white powdery stuff spread? Did you wipe it off gently with just water? Any more spots or curling or anything? If it didn't look noticeably worse I might leave it another day again without the baking soda treatments. Picture helps!

Asesino, sorry I wasn't able to reply earlier, been quite busy.

I think some of my PPM readingsh have been particularly high because I had to use pH up and pH down, I've read that these affect the values - is this a problem or should I be looking at ppm with nutes only and disregard what the pH up/down adds on to it?

I don't actually think the white stuff is spreading, it just seems to be there, even after I wipe it off gently with just water.. Since the last time I've been on here I did try the baking soda mix, but that doesn't seem to have made much difference tbh.

I do think that the girls are growing faster now, still some "curls" and dry, crispy, white/yellowish tips there (particularly on lowest set of fan leaves) , but overall I think they're looking better - here's some pictures I just took, let me know what you think!

PS: Not sure how to get these pics smaller, sorry for the horrendous format of my posts

 

[Asesino85]

Asesino, sorry I wasn't able to reply earlier, been quite busy.

I think some of my PPM readingsh have been particularly high because I had to use pH up and pH down, I've read that these affect the values - is this a problem or should I be looking at ppm with nutes only and disregard what the pH up/down adds on to it?

I don't actually think the white stuff is spreading, it just seems to be there, even after I wipe it off gently with just water.. Since the last time I've been on here I did try the baking soda mix, but that doesn't seem to have made much difference tbh.

I do think that the girls are growing faster now, still some "curls" and dry, crispy, white/yellowish tips there (particularly on lowest set of fan leaves) , but overall I think they're looking better - here's some pictures I just took, let me know what you think!

PS: Not sure how to get these pics smaller, sorry for the horrendous format of my posts

Looking way better man! I would keep an eye on that white stuff and just see if it anything happens. The new growth is the key. If those leaves start getting that white stuff on them (and you aren't foliar feeding or putting anything on them) then maybe there is some concern. I'm not sure why I didn't think of this earlier but it could be a burn of some sort. If you left water on the leaves and had the light close then that water acts like a magnifying glass, plus you had nutes in the water so it could have burned them a little just sitting there for a long period. Lets see what the new stuff looks like in a few days and we should be able to tell.

The bottom leaves typically get plucked off pretty early in the grows if you decide to defoliate. I think selective defolation can benefit yield so I now have kind of a schedule put together. I will be including this in my next update which will be today so stay tuned.

PH up is potassium hydroxide and PH down is any kind of nitrate. There is probably many other ways to make it but either way you are adding some mineral into water, increasing the PPM. I guess I haven't tried it out but it shouldn't increase it that much I would think. Once you get a set schedule and water amount down you'll know exactly how much to put in just by eyesight. It becomes a habit I guess and you avoid putting too much in of one and then having to counteract it with the other.. and then oops! Gotta go back to the first one again. All in all I let me PH swing between 5.7-5.9, you'll get it down. You are on the right track now! Hopefully my next post clears up a lot of things on how I feed/water, things you'll be running into shortly.

 

[Asesino85]

Day 25/9 Flower - First off I want to give a little update on my veg tent. I have been working on as what my friend calls a "screenless ScrOG". Basically it's just supercropping and training so the plant is even all around like using a ScrOG net. My Chemdawg clone is a great example. I can't wait to get this into flower and see what it does but I am really attached to this one.

Onto the stars of this grow. First off my flower tent is now full. One of the 4 girls in my veg tent just is really small, kind of like my Purple Trainwreck last grow. In fact I started thinking that maybe it got mixed up because of how it's growing. The one I have labeled Purple Trainwreck is growing nicely, like the Ayahuasca Purple should be. Only time will tell but because it's so small I stuck it in the last corner free in my flower tent. I will not be using the net for this girl. I will also not be defoliating her. The light she will get will be good but I'm just going to let it grow and see if I can get much out of it.

The other two Ayahuasca's are both a little different. The smaller of the two I have about 10 good colas and I am just going to let it go now. They are on day 9 so just going to let the stretch happen for the last week. The bigger one I was able to train well against the net and it will get a heavier defoliation. This will happen on day 15.

The freebie keep growing nicely and I am pretty happy with it. The bud sights are have lots of thick white hairs spring out now and I think this is my favorite part of the flowering phase. Week 3-5 is pretty fun.

Lastly I have decided on a pretty set schedule for feedings now. The motto of this grow is less or more when it comes to nutrients and it seems to be working great. I am basically trying out the Lucas formula but modified (of course!). The Lucas formula basically states that when using a 3 part series you can get rid of the grow nutes and just use the micro and flower. You use a ratio of 0/6/9 throughout the whole grow. It's meant for coco and has had proven success. The schedule is basically to feed one day and then water the next two days, basically feed everyday.

When using General Hydroponic Flora Series (3 part) I use a ratio of 1/1/1 (ML/GAL) for veg stage. I feed and water for 2 days and then let the 3rd day dry out. Twice a week I add 1 ML/GAL of cal-mag.

I basically give each plant 1L (about 1/4 GAL) of water/feed in veg. I use 3 gallon buckets and this amount seems to keep the coco moist but not drenched. Everyone's grow areas are different and humidity can play a large role in how fast the buckets dry up or stay too moist. It is A-Ok to skip a watering to let things dry out. I encourage it as it promotes the roots to branch out to find water and get larger. Larger roots = bigger buds.

For flower I use the 0/6/9 ratio. I do not skip waterings in the flower stage. Following the Lucas Formula that would be one days worth followed by two days of just water. Splitting that into 3rds since I am watering and feeding daily it ends up being 2 ML/GAL of micro nutes and 3 ML/GAL of flower nutes and 1ML/GAL of Cal-mag. The freebie and the larger Ayahuasca are at the point where they each get a 1/2 GAL of water. The other two are smaller and I've only been giving them 1/4 GAL. Flush the last week with plain water.

I also defoliate and train pretty hard in the veg stage and get the plants used to plucking and losing leaves. I stop about 5 days before flipping to flower. I heavily defoliate around day 15 of flower and then again at day 30 but not so heavy. The last defoliation is day 45 and it just taking some larger fan leaves. This exposes the light to the bug sights and if defoliation is done right it helps, especially with a ScrOG net. The stuff not getting light really isn't good.

Hope this helps anyone who is struggling with feeding and watering. Everyone has their own system and belief but this is mine from everything I've researched. I think you just have to find the technique that works for you! As always any questions feel free to ask.

 

[pino0911]

As always everything jus looks stellar!! Love the updates great info great pics!! My plants are coming along. I did a experiment myself. With two of my plants one I fimmed and the other I topped. Just wanted to see the benefits of both and which recovers the fastest. Fimming doesn't slow the plant at all but topping does. I will let it grow out then switch to there final pot and the real training will begin. Due to your recommendation. Thanks for all the help and cant wait to see what you come up with like. Oh btw love the scroggless training!! Keep it up big guy!! I will definitely be around!!

Pino's Coco & Perlite - Thunderpaws - First Grow Ever 2017

 

[Asesino85]

As always everything jus looks stellar!! Love the updates great info great pics!! My plants are coming along. I did a experiment myself. With two of my plants one I fimmed and the other I topped. Just wanted to see the benefits of both and which recovers the fastest. Fimming doesn't slow the plant at all but topping does. I will let it grow out then switch to there final pot and the real training will begin. Due to your recommendation. Thanks for all the help and cant wait to see what you come up with like. Oh btw love the scroggless training!! Keep it up big guy!! I will definitely be around!!

Pino's Coco & Perlite - Thunderpaws - First Grow Ever 2017

Yeah in my first grow I fimmed one by accident. Ultimately what matters is light and environment most. Then comes feeding correctly and then comes training and all that. I don't think you will notice too much of a difference between the two if all those other things are in line. Experimenting is fun and I highly encourage it. You won't know what your true style is unless you try all sorts of things.

 

[Asesino85]

Day 29/13 Flower - After a detailed update last time all I can say is that I am following my schedule and just watching the results. So far I am impressed. There is no nute burn and the plants always look happy and healthy. I'm pretty sure now that I understand coco pretty well. I can tell when the plants may need a bit more water or when I can skip one because it's too much. I also have a better understanding of nutrients and how much the plants can take. There will be other methods I try down the road but for now I am really happy with this current grow, especially with having to throw together plants after the two males.

Not much else to report besides I intend to show what I've learned to finish this grow. I am rejuvenated from the males fiasco and girls are all starting to flower and it reminds me of how much fun this is. I am more confident in using the ScrOG net too and am anxious to see the buds. It's nice not worrying about if I am doing something wrong or right this time. I feel pretty confident in the methods that work for me. I think the freebie girl is really starting to show it. So many different ways to use this net that I still want to try but this is looking good to me.

This is the smallest of the Ayahuasca Purple clones. I am not planning on defoliating it much at all and not use the net either, just for support maybe. I don't want to stress it at all in hopes that it will prove me wrong. Either way it was either get cut down or throw it in the flower tent. It is on day 7 flower, so 6 days behind the other Ayahuasca Purple clones.

Next of the three Ayahuasca Purple Clones in size.

Largest of the three Ayahuasca Purples. Lots of bud sights on this one. These clones on day 13 are starting to hit their full stretch stride now and I expect to see some good growth over the next 4 days and then start to slow down. I think they will end up half as high as the freebie and will be perfect.

This freebie girl has me so happy. I really like the way it is filling out. It is healthy and happy and I have a feeling this might be my best plant yet. Very interested to see how it finishes.

Front

Back - Better light on the backside and you can see the nodes are a little tighter.

In close

 

[pino0911]

Looking fantastic as always!! Freebie looks fantastic. Did u have a name or was it jus marked freebie? Looks like she is gonna give a great big free harvest. Lol. Keep the updates coming always look forward to them.

Pino's Coco & Perlite - Thunderpaws - First Grow Ever 2017

 

[PE636]

Ya really nice! That freebie is going to have some big buds by the looks of it!

PE636's Purple Kush Coco Grow

 

[Asesino85]

Looking fantastic as always!! Freebie looks fantastic. Did u have a name or was it jus marked freebie? Looks like she is gonna give a great big free harvest. Lol. Keep the updates coming always look forward to them.

They were 20 free seeds sent with some feminized seeds I got. Nothing was labeled because I think when seeds get mixed up at the shop they can't sell them anymore due to not giving the customer the right seed. They probably just give these away as a promotion and then they can do something with them!

 

[pino0911]

Well looks like u won the freebie lottery!! Lol!! Either way it takes a great grower to take the seed to its full potential. They fell in the right hands.

Pino's Coco & Perlite - Thunderpaws - First Grow Ever 2017

 

[TheBlaze]

Looking good bud.

 

[Coloradokid19]

Man does that freebie girl have some stacks!! Everything is coming along great! Never skipping a beat over here!

I also really how the Ayahuasca Purple looks, especially those nice long fingers on those fans. Idk why I love leaves that look like that lol

Keep on keepin on, doing amazing work man have a good one!


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[Asesino85]

Man does that freebie girl have some stacks!! Everything is coming along great! Never skipping a beat over here!

I also really how the Ayahuasca Purple looks, especially those nice long fingers on those fans. Idk why I love leaves that look like that lol

Keep on keepin on, doing amazing work man have a good one!

Yeah it does but I think they are a little too far spaced out. This was likely due to how many plants I had in veg a long time ago and getting proper light in my veg tent with only one light at the time. My clones in my veg tent right now the nodes are pretty tight. Tightest I've had and there is only 3 clones in there, so plenty of light to everything. I can't wait to start with new seeds here. That way I can train early and enhance roots and get plenty of light from day 1.

I know I am being picky but at this point it's the little things that matter to take it to the next level. Gotta keep improving.

 

[Coloradokid19]

Yeah it does but I think they are a little too far spaced out. This was likely due to how many plants I had in veg a long time ago and getting proper light in my veg tent with only one light at the time. My clones in my veg tent right now the nodes are pretty tight. Tightest I've had and there is only 3 clones in there, so plenty of light to everything. I can't wait to start with new seeds here. That way I can train early and enhance roots and get plenty of light from day 1.

I know I am being picky but at this point it's the little things that matter to take it to the next level. Gotta keep improving.

You're exactly right! I really don't think there's such thing as too picky ha. And with the more and more we learn, the more picky we can be!

Also hopefully you'll pop more seeds here soon and get that training started on them! Can't wait to see that!


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[Asesino85]

Just making a note that today was day 30 for the freebie and 14 for the other two Ayahuasca Purples. The two got most everything stripped below the net and then any fan leaf 1/2" or more extended out from the stalk or any blocking nodes below got cut. The freebie had all the larger fan leaves removed but a lot of new stuff left. Not quite as tough as the defoil I did on here on day 15. I know it is only 14 for the Ayahuasca Purples but anywhere between 14-16 is good. Quite a bit different looking in here now. Left the little one completely alone.

CK sorry man, your pretty leaves are gone now