Bluter's Happy Home For Hilarious Hempsters

[Justin Goody]

there's a couple growers here who do something similar. also seen growers elsewhere mention it plays nicer with some silica.

there's a few things about MC that i always found questionable. but it's performed well enough i adapted, and the ease of use can't be beat.

I do same as you and go by eye. With MC you wouldn’t think you’d need Cal Mag especially when your water is loaded with calcium already like mine- but sure enough. Under the LEDs for some reason it’s generally the first problem that pops up for me. In my outdoor garden with regular veggies (especially zucchini) it was a huge problem for a few years. Potassium silicate doesn’t seem to fix it for me.
Funny enough I didn’t have much luck using geoflora indoors but I incorporated it into my veg garden this year (cause I had a few bags laying around) and had the best crops of veggies ever with hardly any blossom rot and no added Ca.

 

[Wastei]

I do same as you and go by eye. With MC you wouldn’t think you’d need Cal Mag especially when your water is loaded with calcium already like mine- but sure enough. Under the LEDs for some reason it’s generally the first problem that pops up for me. In my outdoor garden with regular veggies (especially zucchini) it was a huge problem for a few years. Potassium silicate doesn’t seem to fix it for me.
Funny enough I didn’t have much luck using geoflora indoors but I incorporated it into my veg garden this year (cause I had a few bags laying around) and had the best crops of veggies ever with hardly any blossom rot and no added Ca.

Do you monitor your pH growing indoors in containers? Most nutrient deficiencies are pH related in nature. I need to add potassium silicate with MegaCrop with RO water and without it. Impossible for me to keep a solution pH stable for more than a couple of hours either way. Chelators like humic/fulvic acid really help making all minerals more bioavailable.

Geoflora is best applied outdoors in a bioactive environment. You will have a hard time getting the nutrient bioavailable without the active soil to help break them down properly indoors. You can keep making EWC teas and such but then you're back doing more work than traditional salt based nutrients.

Cheers!

 

[Azimuth]

Geoflora is best applied outdoors in a bioactive environment. You will have a hard time getting the nutrient bioavailable without the active soil to help break them down properly indoors. You can keep making EWC teas and such but then you're back doing more work than traditional salt based nutrients.

Geoflora comes with the microbes to break the nutrients down in every 2 week application. They say it can be used to get an organic result even in a straight coco grow .

 

[Justin Goody]

Do you monitor your pH growing indoors in containers? Most nutrient deficiencies are pH related in nature. I need to add potassium silicate with MegaCrop with RO water and without it. Impossible for me to keep a solution pH stable for more than a couple of hours either way. Chelators like humic/fulvic acid really help making all minerals more bioavailable.

Geoflora is best applied outdoors in a bioactive environment. You will have a hard time getting the nutrient bioavailable without the active soil to help break them down properly indoors. You can keep making EWC teas and such but then you're back doing more work than traditional salt based nutrients.

Cheers!

Sorry I should have clarified I mostly grow in soil indoors. Forgot what thread I was on

I don’t RO my water, it comes right from the tap super hard and almost 8 pH. I’ve been told by many that I don’t need to balance that water first with MC being added but I do anyway and the results have been MUCH less problems due to fluctuations. I used to really struggle with that and finally committed to a few grows using the exact same amount of citric acid each time.
I do add some fulvic/humic acid later in the plant’s flower and when I give it a bit of sugar. I used it a lot more when I grew hydro/aero and back then, monitoring pH was like a full time job so yes I do know what you mean.

 

[Wastei]

Sorry I should have clarified I mostly grow in soil indoors. Forgot what thread I was on

I don’t RO my water, it comes right from the tap super hard and almost 8 pH. I’ve been told by many that I don’t need to balance that water first with MC being added but I do anyway and the results have been MUCH less problems due to fluctuations. I used to really struggle with that and finally committed to a few grows using the exact same amount of citric acid each time.
I do add some fulvic/humic acid later in the plant’s flower and when I give it a bit of sugar. I used it a lot more when I grew hydro/aero and back then, monitoring pH was like a full time job so yes I do know what you mean.

Hard water can be a hard one to beat. Some people make RO and then add back hard water for the added Calcium. It all depends of what minerals already in the mix.

I would use that citric acid to make candies, edibles and gummies instead and replace it with phosphoric acid in your nutrient mix, it's way more stable as an acid.

Cheers!

 

[Wastei]

Geoflora comes with the microbes to break the nutrients down in every 2 week application. They say it can be used to get an organic result even in a straight coco grow .

First thing I tell new growers is don't follow manufacturers recommendations, they're in to sell and will market their products for every single growing situation and want you to overuse it for profit. I've yet too see an organic coir grow performing well. Organics and hydro doesn't mix well and you're better of not mixing the two methods together.

Coir needs constant feedings to replenish the medium and the slow release rate is not fast enough for the high cation exchange capacity for coir. You need readily bioavailable nutrients to grow optimally in soilless/hydro.

 

[bluter]

I don’t RO my water, it comes right from the tap super hard and almost 8 pH. I’ve been told by many that I don’t need to balance that water first with MC being added but I do anyway and the results have been MUCH less problems due to fluctuations.

i found things smoothed out when i began using RO. i also ph before feeding.

Coir needs constant feedings to replenish the medium and the slow release rate is not fast enough for the high cation exchange capacity for coir. You need readily bioavailable nutrients to grow optimally in soilless/hydro.

you run multiple feeds per day which helps keep things stable. can normally run a lower ec much more successful when done that way.

 

[Wastei]

i found things smoothed out when i began using RO. i also ph before feeding.





you run multiple feeds per day which helps keep things stable. can normally run a lower ec much more successful when done that way.

That's the proper way to grow in soilless IMO. Some of the best smoke I've ever had was grown in coir with 325ppm / 0.65 EC max under HID's. You need slightly more than that with LED's.

Multiple feedings and drain to waste for the win in containers IMO. I monitor runoff/leachates more than anything in containers since you have the decaying medium and roots to take in to consideration instead of be able to do a complete reservoir change and reset every week like Aero and DWC. Then runoff is more or less identical to the input.

Next time I run Aero I'm converting my system and do drain to waste instead of recycling for the ease, safe operation and better performance. No runoff to really monitor even though I'm gonna collect it and use it for my other greens!

 

[bluter]

No runoff to really monitor even though I'm gonna collect it and use it for my other greens!

we save all our runoff for the outdoor hydro garden. no sense it going in the drain.

 

[bluter]

so just a little book end on the last run - i lost a massive amount to the bud rot. i was hoping to lose only a third but was closer to something like 2/3's by the end. even at that the harvest was great from what i could save.

i got about 10 oz over all. 7 solid jars each holding about an oz and a half. the density and dry weight was some of the best i've had since i started hempy. everything left was about third or so up from the last couple runs.

mind you, i've actually stopped counting the auto run. shit that was a disaster. i don't even know what to do with that weed. it's all jarred up and well cured but it might be compost...

 

[West Hippie]

Don't like to hear the word bud rot , have heard it too much lately. I saw in my email MC thread was still helping out . I bought the supposes V3 but still having to add calmag to the very start . I've missed a lot lately just catching up . Hope you have a better day .

 

[bluter]

Don't like to hear the word bud rot , have heard it too much lately. I saw in my email MC thread was still helping out . I bought the supposes V3 but still having to add calmag to the very start . I've missed a lot lately just catching up . Hope you have a better day .

i'm going nowhere. if you have any questions you can ask here if you like.

i find cal mag helps from about mid veg forward in most versions of MC. i can drop the base amount of MC needed when i use cal-mag to a more comfortable level for some plants. it runs a bit hot. others are fine with it, but i've just incorporated it now since it's easy to avoid stuff.

 

[InTheShed]

That's a big loss bluter. I hope you're left with enough to get you through to the end of whenever your next run is!

 

[Keffka]

so just a little book end on the last run - i lost a massive amount to the bud rot. i was hoping to lose only a third but was closer to something like 2/3's by the end. even at that the harvest was great from what i could save.

i got about 10 oz over all. 7 solid jars each holding about an oz and a half. the density and dry weight was some of the best i've had since i started hempy. everything left was about third or so up from the last couple runs.

mind you, i've actually stopped counting the auto run. shit that was a disaster. i don't even know what to do with that weed. it's all jarred up and well cured but it might be compost...

Rot indoors or out? How’d it happen?

 

[NickHardy]

That sucks on the rot front. Where we had some seeded stuff I’m not bothered about smoking (certainly not selling and I like my friends so not giving away!) we just bagged it all up for curing last week in a big mix of 8 strains ). We’re gonna electric grinder it up having gone over it ruthlessly for seeds and make a bunch of pre rolls with it with trim leaves for filler.

10 pack of those from the auto stuff might make some nice Christmas presents for friends? Use those pre made cones for ease

On the rot front - I’ve always thought you can mitigate against *nearly all cases with more airflow intake - not just circulation in the room/tent.

Its the stagnancy of the air (higher temp and Rh is your enemy here too) that encourages it. Bill’s greenhouse he had fans actually clipped to the plants to try and mitigate the hot dank environment in there and still succumbed.

We had a bit in our first grow. My Farmer mate was over and asked him. “Chop it chop all now, brother” we were on our way to buy new shears/trimmers within 5 minutes. That was an easier call as only a week out but he reckons once its there you’re just in consolidation mode.

Cut and hope its not still there while you dry and cure was what he said.

 

[bluter]

That's a big loss bluter. I hope you're left with enough to get you through to the end of whenever your next run is!

oddly it's turned out to be one of my better grows in hempy. the weight and quality of what was left is super decent. i've had a few folk comment on both it's density and potency.

the acapulco gold turned out to be very smooth and slightly earthy. the gelato is super easy to smoke as well, and carries a bit of citrus almost fruity flavour. both of them creep a little bit, you can feel the effects as you smoke, but don't get fooled into thinking it will stop there. neither start to fully hit til about 10 - 20 minutes after.

the gelato will take your head off if you roll them too large lol.

the acapulco is a little more mellow, and both last fairly long.

Rot indoors or out? How’d it happen?

i ran an indoor summer this year. both temps and rh managed to spike a little too far in to flower, and i need more circulation in the flower space if i'm gonna run summer grows. i only need 2 small 6 inch fans and the extractor going in the winter grows. it can't keep up to the summer conditions.

 

[Stellabluez]

hi 420 - finally got a moment to catch up. hope everyone is staying safe in these stupid stupid days ...

time for an easter treat edition of What's Going on in Bluter's Kitchen ? ...

this one is gonna be delicious ....

we've been chatting in the thread about vegetable glycerin for a few days.

infused vegetable glycerin is kind of popular here. vg is a clear or slightly yellowish liquid mostly made from vegetable, palm , or coconut oils. it has a slightly sweet taste to it and is a bit like syrup in consistency. it is low in calories, but is a poor sugar replacement as it's level of sweetness is not that high. it's great for our purposes though.

vg is commonly a by-product of the soap making industry, and is used in a lot of cosmetics as well. if you add a tiny bit of nitric acid to it - it can benefit heart attack victims and folk with bad tickers. add a touch more nitric acid, and you create the explosive base product used in all killing machines everywhere.


so clearly we need to tie up all the product not used for keeping ladies vain and hearts going ...


vg is normally done as a cold infusion. unfortunately the process is time consuming and the extraction rate can be pretty poor. the bud is decarbed, then bottled up in a big jar of the vg liquid and left to sit for 3 - 8 months. the jar needs to get tumbled a couple times a day in order to get the cannabis all through it while the trichomes migrate from the plant material to the liquid. the end product winds up at something like a 40 - 50% extraction rate.


that won't quite cut it. oh canada we can do better....


for a few years i made a vg tincture using a crock pot and a heat infusion process. it has a far better extraction rate than the cold process, but required decarb and a couple other finicky things to start. when i began infusing oils with the instant pot method - i realized immediately vegetable glycerin could probably work in that process.

and here it is ...


there are a couple measurement changes, but the basic process is identical to the instant pot oil infusion method. i do a two cook process, meaning i run two instant pot cook cycles with a cool down period between.

i usually start with 500 ml - 2 cups - of the vegetable glycerin ...

vg.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

vegetable glycerin ...

this is 250 ml - 1/4 cup, less than the amount of oil i would normally infuse. the reason is vg will "boil up" inside the instant pot more violently than an oil. i use a lesser amount in order to ensure it stays inside the infusion bowl i put in the instant pot.


pull out that double boiler you put together for the last Bluter's Kitchen episode and warm that vg up on a low heat.

vg heating.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

warming up vegetable glycerin ...

this starts the processes and simply helps it flow better when you pour it in the infusion bowl. vg is syrupy and you wanna be able to get everything out of that bottle you paid for. it can be overly expensive for what it is i noticed...

weigh out your bud while the vg is warming ....

vg weigh.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

weighing out bud for vegetable glycerin infusion ...

through a bunch of experimentation i have found 20 - 24 grams of dried bud is best for this recipe. this a bit more than is required for oil infusions. the vg does not infuse as well, and the extra tends to make up for it. you can play with amounts to hit a level you personally like. i use the same measurements for both cbd and thc base cooks. this is a cbd cook.

grind up the bud and pour that warm vegetable syrup goodness all over it ....

vg pour.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

adding vegetable glycerin to cannabis ....

the bud will float. i let it soak a couple minutes to let it take up the vg and settle. can help the process a bit by pressing the bud down with a tablespoon.

vg soak.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

soaking bud in vegetable glycerin ...

don't be too finicky about it. i just get the worst of it to settle. as per regular infusion - i cover the bowl with aluminium foil before putting it in the instant pot, and i don't want too much sticking to the top.

pull out the magic machine .....

instant pot.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

magician's secret ....

get enough water in there to just touch the bottom of the rack ...

watered IP.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

IP water ... lol ;-)

foil up your infusion mix bowl and get 'er in there ....

IP loaded.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

ip loaded ... lol

set your instant pot up for the standard infusion time and cook settings ....

Ip time.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

ip infusion timer and cook settings ...

and away we go.

now it's just keep to the set cook and cool times, and we should be ready by tomorrow. i take about a day or two to do the whole process.

quick notes :

i do a two cook process, meaning i run the exact same cycle in the instant pot twice, with a minimum 8 hr cool down period between. this helps pull more terpenes and cannabinoids out, but will effect taste. some folk may prefer a single cook, with a milder effect.


the 8 hr cool down is crucial. running a second cook too soon could destroy terpenes, cannabinoids, effect, etc.
i find the cool down needs to be more thorough with the vg than with an oil. it probably has something to do with the thickness.

letting the mix settle, or cold infuse for a longer period, at any time between or after the two cooks will enhance terpene flavours. debatable if it gains potency, but i would bet you may get some.

for a supreme treat, i will cook and jar some up with the cannabis still in, then forget about it to "cure", until the mood strikes me to strain it out and use it. this is simply adding a shorter cold infusion process to the instant pot method.

it is usable on it's own right after the first or second cook.


ding ... ! through the magic of interwebz the instant pot has finished a coupla cooks.

all done cook.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

ip finished cook cycle ...

somehow thought that would be much more exciting -- --

get out the trusted canning strainer and cheese cloth - a la @SweetSue 's instant pot infusion straining method - it's really the best way.

strain tools.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

stuff to stain infused oils and vg ..

get some clips and a jar and set it all up ...

strainer set.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

strainer set up for infused oils and vegetable glycerin,

and interruption .

before you dig the infusion bowl out of the instant pot :

the whole instant pot method is kind of a prepare / set / walk away while it does it's thing process. -- like grandma's crock-pot. almost too easy lol.

if you are like me, i will set things up and let them run overnight, or when i am away at work. often i won't get to the stuff till well after it has finished it's cook.

since the vg is so thick, i will warm it in the instant pot for 5 - 10 min before straining. don't let it go too far or forget it - the stuff can re-cook uncontrolled fast - super no bueno

warmed carefully for straining after a good cool down.

re-warm1.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

re-warming an infusion ..

dig it out of the instant pot

in/out instant pot bowl.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

in / out instant pot infusion bowl ..

try to strain it while still warm. you'll get way more out easier. the stuff won't strain as easy as an infused oil would.

the moment you take the foil off the bowl you will see how much the stuff boils up ---

bubblin vg.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

bubblin vg set fora straining ...

strain it out

IMG_2878.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

straining out infused vegetable glycerin ...

if you do the infused oils you will see how much thicker the stuff is.

make sure to squeeze all that delicious goodness out after you have done the initial straining.

vg press.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

pressing infused vg

bit more hands on - -

hard squeeze.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

clean squeeze trick for infused oils / vg ..

if you wrap a baggie around the top you can get an extra squeeze out. would normally do this with gloves, but those are needed better places these days.




make sure you invert the clean side of the baggie around the squeezed out weed.

squeezed vg_2887.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

squeezed vegetable glycerin weed ready to store ...

keep it in the cheesecloth and all. pop the baggie in the freezer. it will keep indefinite. dump the weed - sans cheesecloth duh - in your favorite recipe for a sweet weed edible. have never tossed anything from a vg infusion. ever. so yummy.


anyway you should end up with something like this.

vg tincture.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

vegetable glycerin tincture ...

will generally be deep dark honey to brown colour with green hue.

dropper bottles are the best way to divvy it up. i have a clean syringe and tube rig i use to help. it's not hard to take apart and clean after. i found it easier than tiny funnels.

tincture fill.JPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

filling glycerin tincture bottles ..

should get something like this .. i get all drooly looking at it sometime ...

vg tinctureJPG

• bluter
• Apr 10, 2020

vegetable glycerin tincture...

dosing is 1 - 2 dropper fulls sublingual - placed under the tongue - hold it there as long as you can without swallowing. it's hard - delicious.

wait 20 - 30 min between dosing to get a clear idea of where you are going. especially with a thc tincture.

length can be close to an edible but onset is faster. way faster.

i do mostly med stuff - but i have folk begging for the thc cooks. and well you know.
if they don't grow i just kinda shrug as i'm not in sales ...

to increase absorption : i recommend heating a cup of water in a microwave the same as you would a cup of coffee. place the dropper bottle in the cup for a minute or so before dosing to warm it.

flavour is about what you think the base weed would be if sweet and delicious lol

some folk report a slight "burnt" taste. sometime the weed terpenes contribute to this, but i notice it is more present in this method. there may be a slight caramelization of some of the sugars in the vg that would contribute as well. it really varies with the weed. you get a great expression of the terpene flavours, so who cares ..

extraction is pretty decent -- a flat guess is 70 - 75%.


i really like the cbd cook stuff. i give a bunch to my folks. super great for a general hit cbd bomb .
have watched their movement and moods improve real time on dosing.

they don't even realize -- all they know is everything is ok so i'll keep doing it ...

happy easter guys. stay safe. connect with family if you can't be there in person.


this is my easter egg to you ...

Wow that's amazing 411 thank you !

 

[bluter]

Wow that's amazing 411 thank you !

you may wanna take note that i normally do a double cook on most of my infusions with a min 8hr cool down period in between.

 

[Stellabluez]

you may wanna take note that i normally do a double cook on most of my infusions with a min 8hr cool down period in between.

Noted!! I'm very stuck between rock & hard place with the whole experimental stages , I could loose housing if anything goes wrong. So I'm always looking for easy no cook LD with lupus hands
But thank you

 

[bluter]

Noted!! I'm very stuck between rock & hard place with the whole experimental stages , I could loose housing if anything goes wrong. So I'm always looking for easy no cook LD with lupus hands
But thank you

if you're doing meds, similar types of finicky processing happens in all methods. i actually use the instant pot since it simplified the process and is less finicky than other approaches.

keep in mind that it does not do a smokable product though. it is only for med type infusion.