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- #81
All my other grows with other nutes I always made sure the run off was close to the same pH as what I put in & No Problems. Didn't do that this time & having issues.
What's my problem?
- Thread starter Buds Buddy
- Start date
recommended dosage wk 3 - 4 flower is 5.5g / gal. assuming no boosters or other additives. climbs to 6.0 wk 5 - 6.
start with recommended and adjust according to read.
start with recommended and adjust according to read.
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
The "recommended" is what is getting people in trouble. Recommended applications rates for a field are going to be wildly different than in a closed container, and a large plant in large container is logically going to take more nutrient than a smaller plant in a smaller container. With this firmly in mind, there is no recommended amount that can be trusted, it all depends on the local circumstances.
PE636
Well-Known Member
Starting with the recommendation is all good as long as it's not already too high! Adding more no problem. Taking it back out ain't happening.
I will add this as a theoretical addendum some may find interesting.. My long-standing understanding is that many garden and grain type crops have higher nutrient needs in cool cloudy seasons. This is due to the reduction in transpiration. I have a theory that an overnuted plant should get drastically reduced light/cooler temps to help recovery. Haven't had a chance to try it out thankfully but there ya have it!
I will add this as a theoretical addendum some may find interesting.. My long-standing understanding is that many garden and grain type crops have higher nutrient needs in cool cloudy seasons. This is due to the reduction in transpiration. I have a theory that an overnuted plant should get drastically reduced light/cooler temps to help recovery. Haven't had a chance to try it out thankfully but there ya have it!
PE636
Well-Known Member
'Zactly!
Makes sense, less photosynthesis the less nutrient uptake and the easier it is for the plant to recover.
PE636
Well-Known Member
Hot and sunny and the plant will want to uptake more water than nutes. I suspect these amino chelated nutes are even harder for the plant to sort out than say in an organic grow.
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
I submit, that this is not true when everything is in balance and there are no lockouts. I say again, that using MC on this last run, I ended up with a superior grow that looks and tastes just as good as any organic grow I have done. I am excited to get going again in a few months so I can directly compare some organic grows and MC grows in the same room so I can directly compare with several side by side tests over the remainder of this year.
I used to use Dyna Gro Foliage Pro, Dyna Gro Pro Tekt, and a Cal Mag supplement. 1
1 ratio of each product. Now I replace the Foliage Pro with Mega Crop. Instead of mls of Foliage Pro it's mgs of Mega Crop. For buffered soil-less or soil grows you should not have to pH your nutes at all. The substrate is going to manage your pH for you. Only exception is if you have very alkaline water (ie 300ppm). If your water is 150ppm or less it should be a non-issue.
PE636
Well-Known Member
Oh absolutely when everything is balanced and the overall strength is in order she works a treat! I just meant I thought it might be a bit more touchy when approaching the limits(of nutes or environment). ...Yes I've been lurking your journals, very informative so thanks for all your efforts! I too am gearing up to try organics, I'm hoping to summon you to my own journal eventually!
The Celt
Well-Known Member
@Emilya hit it on the head with this statement. Growers forget that every plant, even within the same strain, will have different requirements and is one reason I try to only grow one strain at a time now. Plants, especially our favourite, can not be treated with a cookie cutter approach.
”Recommended“ just means “starting point” or “baseline”.
PE636
Well-Known Member
Thanks for mentioning alkalinity in conjunction with ph. It seems to be such a misunderstood concept.I used to use Dyna Gro Foliage Pro, Dyna Gro Pro Tekt, and a Cal Mag supplement. 1
I missed all the fun!
This information applies regardless of the brand of synthetic nutrient you are using. Whether you need to pH your nutrients is entirely based on your medium (buffered or unbuffered) and not your nutes.
I said I hadn't gone over 4.5g/gallon at the time we were speaking, early in flower. I'm in week 6 and am just now moving to 5.25g/gallon (from 5.0). I do not believe in pushing your photoperiod plant with more grams/gallon on a schedule.
No contradiction at all. If you are in a buffered medium (which ProMix is), you do not need to pH your nutes. You can pH your nutes or not, but as it says in the opening post in my thread on the topic, the alkalinity of your water and the makeup of nitrogen content of your nutes can cause changes in the pH of your substrate. This change will only show up in a slurry test, and you cannot make any adjustments to that pH change by changing the pH of your nute water. If your substrate pH has changed to the extent that corrective action is needed, you will need to add something to the medium itself to put it back where you want it (by working in or soaking it in the corrective elements).
This information applies regardless of the brand of synthetic nutrient you are using. Whether you need to pH your nutrients is entirely based on your medium (buffered or unbuffered) and not your nutes.
You only need to pH your nutes if you are in a hydro medium, not soilless. Most soilless (peat) media are buffered with lime/calcium the way soils are.
Even if you have very alkaline water, adjusting the pH of your nutes will not prevent the medium from using up the buffering elements and rising as a result of the alkalinity.
Coco is soiless and has no buffers so it needs to have ph adjusted.
All hydro is soilless, but in my readings, "soilless" usually refers to peat-based vs humus-based media. Sorry for the confusion!
All good, peat is a horse of a different color for sure.
- Thread starter
- #98
All I can say at this point is I'll be glad when this grow is over & I can go back to GH nutes. Anybody live near Phx. AZ. & want a FREE unopened 1000 gr. bag of MC ? All yours !!! I don't like this stuff at all. I'd much rather mix 10 different things & not have these problems. I'll go back to pH-ing my nutes & run off like I always have & avoid these issues. MC just isn't my thing & I don't care to spend the next year trying to perfect it. I'll go with what I know. I think that's my best bet.
Every grow so far I've switched Nutes, Lights, etc... trying to find the easiest & cheapest route that works best for me. So far MC is at the very bottom of my list.
But for now I'm just going to back the MC down to 5 gr. & consider the yellowing leaves just part of the normal flower cycle like The Celt suggested it is. After all, that is what I thought too but it just seemed too soon. I'm already expecting a shitty yield because of the issues I've had.
Every grow so far I've switched Nutes, Lights, etc... trying to find the easiest & cheapest route that works best for me. So far MC is at the very bottom of my list.
But for now I'm just going to back the MC down to 5 gr. & consider the yellowing leaves just part of the normal flower cycle like The Celt suggested it is. After all, that is what I thought too but it just seemed too soon. I'm already expecting a shitty yield because of the issues I've had.
- Thread starter
- #99
This is what I don't understand. All 3 plants are in the same exact soil from the same bag. So the substrate is all the same. All 3 plants were fed the exact same thing until 2 weeks ago when I started having issues. If the soil is the same & the nutes are the same how can I possibly get 3 different run off pH's? That doesn't make any sense to me. I don't see how a different strain could make a difference at all as far as the pH of the soil. Please tell me how this happens. I don't get it & am here to learn. Thanks !
Runoff pH is not a thing. Slurry testing with distilled water is the only method of checking the pH of your substrate.
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