In The Lab

[Conradino23]

More and more growers are discovering the usefulness of Brix testing, and the benefits that come with it.

 

[Dr Fish]

Is there any brix testing being done by hydroponic growers? You're just testing for plant sugars aren't you.... If high plant sugars indicate a healthy plant, it seems like there could be other ways to get a high brix plant...

 

[Graytail]

It's not really the sugars that we're after. Brix measures ALL dissolved solids, including minerals - it's mostly the mineral levels that indicate health. Higher levels mean more available building blocks for the plants, like fully stocked shelves, and it's the relationship between the plants and the soil biota that make it happen. It's a dynamic, constantly adjusting process. Anything the plant needs from the soil is communicated through the root exudates, which feed the bacteria and fungi that produce the needed nutrient. If and when the need is satisfied, the roots instantly stop producing the exudates that feed that particular biota. We can't realistically do that ourselves.

There's probably a way to get similar results in hydro, but that's not a friendly environment for the biota we use, so you'd have to find a way to adapt them, or try to measure and feed yourself. In theory, it seems like it could be done, but living biota in a hydro setup are usually a bad thing - hard to control them - typically turns out badly.

 

[Noob4x4grow]

I thought Brix was literally the measurement of sucrose in a liquid solution.

 

[Doc Bud]

Is there any brix testing being done by hydroponic growers? You're just testing for plant sugars aren't you.... If high plant sugars indicate a healthy plant, it seems like there could be other ways to get a high brix plant...

Plants are designed/adapted/evolved (take your pick) to grow in living soil. That they can grow hydroponically is more a testament to their toughness and ability to adapt than anything else. They grow best when the roots are communicating with the mycorhyzza and the myco are as happy as can be.

High Brix growing is all about happy soil. The plants are a byproduct of happy soil. Without the biota, we simply can't max out the plant's potential.

It's not really the sugars that we're after. Brix measures ALL dissolved solids, including minerals - it's mostly the mineral levels that indicate health. Higher levels mean more available building blocks for the plants, like fully stocked shelves, and it's the relationship between the plants and the soil biota that make it happen. It's a dynamic, constantly adjusting process. Anything the plant needs from the soil is communicated through the root exudates, which feed the bacteria and fungi that produce the needed nutrient. If and when the need is satisfied, the roots instantly stop producing the exudates that feed that particular biota. We can't realistically do that ourselves.

There's probably a way to get similar results in hydro, but that's not a friendly environment for the biota we use, so you'd have to find a way to adapt them, or try to measure and feed yourself. In theory, it seem like it could be done, but living biota in a hydro setup are usually a bad thing - hard to control them - typically turns out badly.

Yep!!

I thought Brix was literally the measurement of sucrose in a liquid solution.

Actually, Brix is a term used to describe how a solution bends (refracts) light. The more that is dissolved in the solution, the more the refraction occurs. Sugar, minerals, dissolved solids of other types, oils....all of it bends light and therefore can have a Brix number.

Certain oils are often measured with a refractometer.....140 brix or higher.

So it's not just sugar, although there certainly is plenty of that. It's minerals and such, like what Graytail said.

Bottom line: our taste buds are great brix meters. Once you've tried High Brix weed, you'll understand.

 

[Noob4x4grow]

They must be using the term loosely where I live. There a tons of wine makers here and they use the term to describe how sweet the grapes are that are used to make the different types of wines. I'm not professing to be an expert in any way. I was actually thinking the bud that I will be growing in the kit would be a sweeter tasting bud in terms of smoke. Man I feel like a noob now.

 

[Graytail]

In wine making, sugar levels are important, so they're mostly interested in that.

I wonder how sugar levels in cannabis "fruit" affect terpene production ...

 

[ShiggityFlip]

In wine making, sugar levels are important, so they're mostly interested in that.

I wonder how sugar levels in cannabis "fruit" affect terpene production ...

Whenever I get a really good sweet fruit it also has the highest levels of taste and smell.so I think that would translate to cannabis buds as well. The way to get a sugar surplus is to have so much of what you need that you can afford to just store sugar.

A sugar starved plant can't afford to spend "money" on anything but the basics.

 

[Conradino23]

We all have to keep in mind that cannabis is different from any fruit bearing plant like grapevine cause it produces flower, but no fruit. In winemaking Brix levels are important cause depending on the variety you want it low or high or medium. Not every type of grapes is used mature as every additional percentages point of fructose contributes to higher alcohol count during fermentation when sugars get consumed by yeast. For example dry grapes that get left on the vine after cutting the branches are used for making passito in Italy, which is sweet dessert wine, but varieties like Chardonnay used for spumante are picked before they are mature cause winemakers want to preserve the freshness, acidity and saponity during spumantization.

With cannabis we are not into fermentation, and the only factor that contributes to after harvest smell is oxidation of terpenes which they always undergo in drying and curing. However what flavors they produce in flowering depends strictly on the minerals they can pull from the ground in forms of ions. They later form very complicated chains of chemical paths in the plant, amino acids, carbohydrates via photosynthesis, every little element contributing to produce healthy flowers or seeds, and when they are at their highest Brix, we can say that things are perfect for the growth. I believe in the future we'll move to live molecular analysis to figure things farther as the cannabis movement becomes more culturally acceptable.

 

[DrZiggy]

Whenever I get a really good sweet fruit it also has the highest levels of taste and smell.so I think that would translate to cannabis buds as well. The way to get a sugar surplus is to have so much of what you need that you can afford to just store sugar.

A sugar starved plant can't afford to spend "money" on anything but the basics.

- more and more so with my recent grows the smoke has been sweet tasting on different strains. Sometimes I get the bakeshop smell and flavor too. This I attribute this to the HB Kit and dialed in soil; and less playing maybe
People that have sampled say, they experienced sweet herb once or twice; if ever.

 

[DrZiggy]

Docs New thread is up...

The Advanced DS XML 650 LED: a review by Doc Bud.

seats are fill'n up!! come soon or you'll stand


...come only if you want to see 'ATTIC SHELF' herb..

..never heard of ATTIC SHELF????

me either..

spoiler....

nah..

 

[dallin1992]

quick question, I'm pretty sure my buds are setting right now and plan to use catatonic drench but is there a certain tell or just the beginning of bud formation?

 

[DrZiggy]

quick question, I'm pretty sure my buds are setting right now and plan to use catatonic drench but is there a certain tell or just the beginning of bud formation?

dallin, shiggityflip started a very informative thread just for this..."Timing the Cationic Drench"

Timing the cationic drench

 

[Sunshinedaisy]

Hey doc do you mind pming me. I'm interested in your high brix kit

 

[DrZiggy]

Sunshinedaisy, welcome to 420magazine ! and HB

 

[Duggan]

Hey doc do you mind pming me. I'm interested in your high brix kit

Sunshinedaisy, welcome to 420magazine ! and HB

Mornin Daisy....welcome to the Mag. You've come to the right place , make sure to enjoy yourself eh...read lots of journals , especially The HB growers stuff. Cheers to ya !

 

[medmanmike]

Doc, a couple of "watering in veg" questions from the current instructions for you.

The instructions say "Tea...It is mixed with each feeding at the rate of 2.5 mil per 6 plants (30 square feet)" Do you consider watering with H2O + ¼ Transplant a "feeding"? Meaning, Tea should be added?

And, watering in veg is about developing the root structure. You advocate for letting then totally dry out in veg and now say to "Prepare a tub/bucket of water such that when you submerge a dry container from above, the water level is 3/4ths up to the level of the soil. If using a drench, mix it TWICE AS STRONG AS NORMAL. ". Is this the new normal? Meaning, should every watering be using this method? Energy feeding? H2O + 1/4 Transplant? Thx.

 

[ShiggityFlip]

Hey doc do you mind pming me. I'm interested in your high brix kit

Hey Sunshinedaisy!!! Glad to see you made it here! When I saw the screen name I knew it had to be you! Welcome and most of all welcome to Doc Bud's High Brix Super Awesome Kit of magic, wonder, rocks, terpenes and trichomes! Here is some reps your way!

 

[Doc Bud]

Doc, a couple of "watering in veg" questions from the current instructions for you.

The instructions say "Tea...It is mixed with each feeding at the rate of 2.5 mil per 6 plants (30 square feet)" Do you consider watering with H2O + ¼ Transplant a "feeding"? Meaning, Tea should be added?

And, watering in veg is about developing the root structure. You advocate for letting then totally dry out in veg and now say to "Prepare a tub/bucket of water such that when you submerge a dry container from above, the water level is 3/4ths up to the level of the soil. If using a drench, mix it TWICE AS STRONG AS NORMAL. ". Is this the new normal? Meaning, should every watering be using this method? Energy feeding? H2O + 1/4 Transplant? Thx.

Hey MMM,

Many of us are including 1/4 strength Transplant with the water only, IE instead of straight water. That's how I look at it. Instead of watering with straight water between drenches, I add a splash of Transplant. No Tea, just Transplant.

When I do a "feeding" or root drench, I add the Tea.

The thing to realize when dunking the plants is that most of what you mix up for the dunking will be waste. So, if you were trying to distribute 1.5 oz of GE to 6 plants top watering, you'd add 1.5 oz GE plus 2-3 mils Tea to 6 gallons of water and give each plant a gallon.

But when you dunk them in veg, half or more of that water is left behind....so you've got to mix it stronger for the dunking to be effective. And it's REALLY effective, but it does use more product.

You could easily modify things so that you only dunk them when you water and not when you feed, if you're trying to conserve the drenches.

I like to dunk as much as possible because it keeps the soil from compacting. Top watering is fine if you can't dunk, but you'll get better results if you dunk 'em.

In bloom, I can't dunk so I use saucers. A small amount down the top, the rest wicks up from the bottom....again the soil loves not being compacted from top watering, BUT TOP WATERING STILL WORKS GREAT. These are just the little things.

The big thing is to do the wet/dry thing in veg. Thick stems, tight internodes, higher calyx/leaf ratio and massive roots. That's all done in veg.

 

[Scop]

If I say dunk enough times out loud it really makes me believe it!

I want to go dunk some plants right now!