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- #161
SmokzAlot - K.I.S.S. My CoCo and OC+
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MSquared
Well-Known Member
those look like some quality beans you have there! 
are you going to pop some of those soon or is that down the road for you?
Hope you had a good weekend!
are you going to pop some of those soon or is that down the road for you?Hope you had a good weekend!
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- #163
SmokzAlot
New Member
I have several options coming to fruition soon so I am unsure at this moment. Just a peek at things to come is the best I can call it right now. Should be able to answer that soon.
Weekend was good, thank you. Need to get started with the outdoor garden soon
Weekend was good, thank you. Need to get started with the outdoor garden soon
TokerJoker
New Member
You know smokz from my experience its always better to have more options than what you need or want!
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- #165
SmokzAlot
New Member
I agree, choice is good....
although sometimes too many choices is not good. Like at the grocery, too many choices.
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- #166
SmokzAlot
New Member
Thanks for stopping in, I will return the favor as well.
No autos here... just feminized
I prefer to do repeat business on my dime... and of course my way.
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- #167
SmokzAlot
New Member
420 Friends,
I'd like to bump a thread of interest if you care to read it. As I was reading and learning, I decided to pull together an FAQ on Diatomaceous Earth (Diatomite). Let me know what you think, and of course add to it by all means.
What is Diatomaceous Earth all about?
I'd like to bump a thread of interest if you care to read it. As I was reading and learning, I decided to pull together an FAQ on Diatomaceous Earth (Diatomite). Let me know what you think, and of course add to it by all means.
What is Diatomaceous Earth all about?
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- #168
SmokzAlot
New Member
Sharing some of my thoughts on OC+ and coco gardening...
I am beginning to suspect OC+ is delivering more N (nitrogen) that I need. Keep in mind the application rate of 2tbsp per gal of medium (approx) From start to finish every specimen has displayed dark green color, more than I am used to. I wasn't alarmed by this, just making note. To date all things grow lush with no slow downs detectable, till they hit flower... Seedling or clones had no issue at all with burning. Just water and go.
Back to the Deficiencies...
Flower 12/12
1. Calcium is first to show.
2. Magnesium follows if #1 is not treated.
3. Potassium will also appear if #1 is not treated.
Soon followed by a myriad of other issues if you don't react in some manner.
This can be easily addressed by supplementing Cal/Mag of some type.
I would like to eliminate the issue or at least minimize it. So I search for more than just treating the symptoms. Keeping it all in the spirit of water and go with OC+ if at all possible.
Coco has an affinity for holding Sodium and Potassium, locking out Calcium and Magnesium. This needs to be countered. First note is that a N overload will lock out Calcium quickly. So if we are overfeeding N we are only making it worse. I also keep in mind that coco as much as it appears to be like soil it is basically an inert medium and brings very little to the table.
So my thoughts are rambling and reasoning in this direction
Reduce the OC+ application rate
Pre load the coco with either cal/mag or dolomite lime
Perhaps add Gypsum for Calcium
Balancing Potassium with the above measures
Add Molasses for the Calcium and trace minerals
Amend coco with Diatomaceous Earth (silica)
Water frequently (mini flush the cation system)
I am beginning to suspect OC+ is delivering more N (nitrogen) that I need. Keep in mind the application rate of 2tbsp per gal of medium (approx) From start to finish every specimen has displayed dark green color, more than I am used to. I wasn't alarmed by this, just making note. To date all things grow lush with no slow downs detectable, till they hit flower... Seedling or clones had no issue at all with burning. Just water and go.
Back to the Deficiencies...
Flower 12/12
1. Calcium is first to show.
2. Magnesium follows if #1 is not treated.
3. Potassium will also appear if #1 is not treated.
Soon followed by a myriad of other issues if you don't react in some manner.
This can be easily addressed by supplementing Cal/Mag of some type.
I would like to eliminate the issue or at least minimize it. So I search for more than just treating the symptoms. Keeping it all in the spirit of water and go with OC+ if at all possible.
Coco has an affinity for holding Sodium and Potassium, locking out Calcium and Magnesium. This needs to be countered. First note is that a N overload will lock out Calcium quickly. So if we are overfeeding N we are only making it worse. I also keep in mind that coco as much as it appears to be like soil it is basically an inert medium and brings very little to the table.
So my thoughts are rambling and reasoning in this direction
Reduce the OC+ application rate
Pre load the coco with either cal/mag or dolomite lime
Perhaps add Gypsum for Calcium
Balancing Potassium with the above measures
Add Molasses for the Calcium and trace minerals
Amend coco with Diatomaceous Earth (silica)
Water frequently (mini flush the cation system)
- Thread starter
- #169
SmokzAlot
New Member
Understanding OC+ and its realtionship to the world of fertilizer.
A clipping from Wiki...
Controlled-release type fertilizers
Urea and formaldehyde, reacted together to produce sparingly soluble polymers of various molecular weights, is one of the oldest controlled-nitrogen-release technologies, having been first produced in 1936 and commercialized in 1955.[11] The early product had 60 percent of the total nitrogen cold-water-insoluble, and the unreacted (quick release) less than 15%. Methylene ureas were commercialized in the 1960s and 1970s, having 25 and 60% of the nitrogen cold-water-insoluble, and unreacted urea nitrogen in the range of 15 to 30%. Isobutylidene diurea, unlike the methylurea polymers, is a single crystalline solid of relatively uniform properties, with about 90% of the nitrogen water-insoluble.
In the 1960s the National Fertilizer Development Center began developing Sulfur-coated urea; sulfur was used as the principle coating material because of its low cost and its value as a secondary nutrient.[11] Usually there is another wax or polymer which seals the sulfur; the slow release properties depend on the degradation of the secondary sealant by soil microbes as well as mechanical imperfections (cracks, etc.) in the sulfur. They typically provide 6 to 16 weeks of delayed release in turf applications. When a hard polymer is used as the secondary coating, the properties are a cross between diffusion-controlled particles and traditional sulfur-coated.
Other coated products use thermoplastics (and sometimes ethylene-vinyl acetate and surfactants, etc.) to produce diffusion-controlled release of urea or soluble inorganic fertilizers. "Reactive Layer Coating" can produce thinner, hence cheaper, membrane coatings by applying reactive monomers simultaneously to the soluble particles. "Multicote" is a process applying layers of low-cost fatty acid salts with a paraffin topcoat.
Besides being more efficient in the utilization of the applied nutrients, slow-release technologies also reduce the impact on the environment and the contamination of the subsurface water.[11]
A clipping from Wiki...
Controlled-release type fertilizers
Urea and formaldehyde, reacted together to produce sparingly soluble polymers of various molecular weights, is one of the oldest controlled-nitrogen-release technologies, having been first produced in 1936 and commercialized in 1955.[11] The early product had 60 percent of the total nitrogen cold-water-insoluble, and the unreacted (quick release) less than 15%. Methylene ureas were commercialized in the 1960s and 1970s, having 25 and 60% of the nitrogen cold-water-insoluble, and unreacted urea nitrogen in the range of 15 to 30%. Isobutylidene diurea, unlike the methylurea polymers, is a single crystalline solid of relatively uniform properties, with about 90% of the nitrogen water-insoluble.
In the 1960s the National Fertilizer Development Center began developing Sulfur-coated urea; sulfur was used as the principle coating material because of its low cost and its value as a secondary nutrient.[11] Usually there is another wax or polymer which seals the sulfur; the slow release properties depend on the degradation of the secondary sealant by soil microbes as well as mechanical imperfections (cracks, etc.) in the sulfur. They typically provide 6 to 16 weeks of delayed release in turf applications. When a hard polymer is used as the secondary coating, the properties are a cross between diffusion-controlled particles and traditional sulfur-coated.
Other coated products use thermoplastics (and sometimes ethylene-vinyl acetate and surfactants, etc.) to produce diffusion-controlled release of urea or soluble inorganic fertilizers. "Reactive Layer Coating" can produce thinner, hence cheaper, membrane coatings by applying reactive monomers simultaneously to the soluble particles. "Multicote" is a process applying layers of low-cost fatty acid salts with a paraffin topcoat.
Besides being more efficient in the utilization of the applied nutrients, slow-release technologies also reduce the impact on the environment and the contamination of the subsurface water.[11]
- Thread starter
- #170
SmokzAlot
New Member
Understanding more about OC+ fertilizer in CoCo growing...
Trace minerals
Many inorganic fertilizers may not provide or replace trace mineral elements in medium which become gradually depleted. This depletion has been linked to studies which have shown a marked fall (up to 75%) in the quantities of such minerals present in fruit and vegetables. Since these trace elements are not routinely added to inorganic fertilizers used in agriculture, one is best to look in a gardening/greenhouse house style of fertilizers. It is becoming more common in gardening in general, along with the spread of Organic gardening awareness. Trace minerals are available as an amendment if desired as well.
coco has none
OC+ has it covered...
...molasses lends a helping hand as well
Trace minerals
Many inorganic fertilizers may not provide or replace trace mineral elements in medium which become gradually depleted. This depletion has been linked to studies which have shown a marked fall (up to 75%) in the quantities of such minerals present in fruit and vegetables. Since these trace elements are not routinely added to inorganic fertilizers used in agriculture, one is best to look in a gardening/greenhouse house style of fertilizers. It is becoming more common in gardening in general, along with the spread of Organic gardening awareness. Trace minerals are available as an amendment if desired as well.
coco has none
OC+ has it covered...
...molasses lends a helping hand as well
Sharing some of my thoughts on OC+ and coco gardening...
I am beginning to suspect OC+ is delivering more N (nitrogen) that I need. Keep in mind the application rate of 2tbsp per gal of medium (approx) From start to finish every specimen has displayed dark green color, more than I am used to. I wasn't alarmed by this, just making note. To date all things grow lush with no slow downs detectable, till they hit flower... Seedling or clones had no issue at all with burning. Just water and go.
Back to the Deficiencies...
Flower 12/12
1. Calcium is first to show.
2. Magnesium follows if #1 is not treated.
3. Potassium will also appear if #1 is not treated.
Soon followed by a myriad of other issues if you don't react in some manner.
This can be easily addressed by supplementing Cal/Mag of some type.
I would like to eliminate the issue or at least minimize it. So I search for more than just treating the symptoms. Keeping it all in the spirit of water and go with OC+ if at all possible.
Coco has an affinity for holding Sodium and Potassium, locking out Calcium and Magnesium. This needs to be countered. First note is that a N overload will lock out Calcium quickly. So if we are overfeeding N we are only making it worse. I also keep in mind that coco as much as it appears to be like soil it is basically an inert medium and brings very little to the table.
So my thoughts are rambling and reasoning in this direction
Reduce the OC+ application rate
Pre load the coco with either cal/mag or dolomite lime
Perhaps add Gypsum for Calcium
Balancing Potassium with the above measures
Add Molasses for the Calcium and trace minerals
Amend coco with Diatomaceous Earth (silica)
Water frequently (mini flush the cation system)
Interesting. So far...4 days of flower in soil...no noticeable deficiencies, although my Vintage looks like crap, shriveled up I'll let you know if anything shows. Thanks for the research. OMM
- Thread starter
- #172
SmokzAlot
New Member
OMM - if it appears it has always been on the lower fan leaves and some bud leave tips. I suspect soil should do much better with OC+ in that regard. But man the growth rate with coco has to be experienced. Stick one in the corner and watch it and water it. You CANNOT over water it. Even with the deficiencies it still finished with her skirt on.
Should state as well that a second dressing in flower is surely beneficial for long winded sativas.
Should state as well that a second dressing in flower is surely beneficial for long winded sativas.
That's what I've heard too SmokzAlot, they really take off.
Might give it a try someday. I would probably become a convert.
I don't really like to many sativas, just some. By all means a second dressing.
One grower put OC+ in a woman's hose and just put it on top the soil. It worked and he could flush.
209 Cali C.G
New Member
TokerJoker
New Member
Just swinging by to see how things are goin. I'm sure all is well.
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- #176
SmokzAlot
New Member
The garden looks good today, did some moving and trimming on the youngest in flower. Tie a little here and there. The sativas are doing very good.
Mostly studying today for future ideas...
Thanks for stopping by..
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- #177
SmokzAlot
New Member
Photos from the GoG...
Indy Mom throwing some bud.. main cola
Her children...
Curling from to much N?
Sativa treats looking better everyday...
Indy Mom throwing some bud.. main cola
Her children...
Curling from to much N?
Sativa treats looking better everyday...
MSquared
Well-Known Member
They look really GREEN, a super dark green in fact with a little twisting. You could be right about the N, but did your temps ever top 80? I have heard that OC+ can dump extra N with higher temps.
Otherwise they look really good!
Otherwise they look really good!
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- #179
SmokzAlot
New Member
They look really GREEN, a super dark green in fact with a little twisting. You could be right about the N, but did your temps ever top 80? I have heard that OC+ can dump extra N with higher temps.
Otherwise they look really good!
82f is the highest it sees. You are correct I was not thinking of the temps I will keep a closer eye on those as well. I have A/C to install that should take care of summer here. My understanding was not hitting the 90's.
Considering they survived a Calcium deficiency they are doing well. I am learning at a whole other curve with this coco as well. Its been fun though...
TokerJoker
New Member
Looking good I'm sure youll figure out the curl soon.
