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Icemud's Breeding Projects And Motherchucking Pollination Extravaganza

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Hey everyone...

Here is a little bonus photo to share with all of you.

This is the 1st tester from my Trainwreck x 79 Xmas Bud seed project that a very close friend of mine is running outdoors.

I haven't come up with an official name for the cross, but I so far was thinking "Gotham Limited" or "1937". Both of the potential names reference a 185 Ton Steam engine train that crashed on Christmas day as it was headed to Philadelphia.

CSI humbold did the same cross and named their "polar express" however since they used different phenos and not sure what trainwreck they used, I'm sure mine is slightly different.

The trainwreck really stretched out the Xmas Bud quite a bit and gave it size, as well as the bud formation structure and branching is definitely inherited from the trainwreck.

The smell so far coming off of her, is that of a very sweet pine. (I haven't smelled it but this is via my buddy). He said it smells just like gun cleaner, like a chemical sweet pine.

The trainwreck is also one of my fastest flowering and finishing plants and it looks like this trait was dominant and showing in this cross, as compared to other plants my buddy has going, this cultivar is about 3 weeks ahead of all the others.

Definitely a very nice cross and very lucky to have a friend willing to run these for me, and send me plenty of photos and reports on all the data I am asking for which will help me learn the traits that are dominant for each strain and how they breed together.

The bud structure itself definitely resembles the 79 Xmas Bud and the leaves also take after the 79 Xmas Bud.

Here she is in all her glory! "Gotham Limited"!!!


 

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Bangi Haze open Pollen project update: Day 15 of flowering from the flip.

Out of 7 bangi haze plants, 3 turned out to be female, and 4 are male.

3 of the male plants look identical and look like the females, and 1 of the males is a much shorter, stockier plant with much broader leaves. I believe this must be the pakistan chitral that is in the lineage, although most of the lineage is congo x nepalese which are both tall sativa type narrow leaf varieties.

I will be using all 4 of the males for the project to offer more variety in the progeny (offspring). Today I opened the tent to see if the ladies were getting thirsty and low and behold, I already see my first pollen dropping from 1 of the 4 males. Wow that was fast! All 4 males look like they are ready to let loose any day now, which is exciting. Now the flowers on the females have to develop more and mature!

The 3 females are just starting to show full flowering as of a couple days ago, as well as all the other "mother" strains in the grow tent. The Bangi Haze are right in line with the timing on the flowering with the rest of the strains.

Structure wise, the 3 females are all different sizes, but close in terms of height and structure. The difference between the tallest and shortest pheno are about 6" difference at most, with the middle pheno being inbetween. The difference in height from the tallest males to the short broad leaf male is about 1' difference, and 3 of the males all are about the same height.

The smell on a stem rub of the females is not very strong right now, but definitely leans towards a sulfur skunky lemon, with a heavyness on the lemon smell, which I really like! hopefully they will keep that lemon!

Well enough of my babbling and onto the photos!!!!



Bangi Haze Females:






Bangi Haze Broad Leaf male:




Bangi Haze other males





Bangi Haze group photo






Full grow tent photo:

 

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Seed Storage: How to keep your seeds viable for many years.
Input from well known breeders in the industry:


So now that I have a nice seed collection building and all of this hard work has been going into preserving my beloved genetics and creating new strains, my biggest concern was "how do I store these seeds to ensure long term viability" and so that I don't see my time and effort go to waste.

I went to Am@zon and ordered myself some oxygen absorbing packets, some moisture dessicants to absorb moisture, and 3 different sizes of ziplock mylar bags. Currently my method of storage was small "dime bags" inside of mailing envelopes labeled and put in a rubbermaid bin which was kept at room temperature in my closet (no AC so some days get very hot). I knew this was not the best way to store them so I decided to get some answers:

I will admit, generally for things like this I will scour the internet for hours looking at science abstracts and all available information to make a good generalization about what is the best way to do things, however with this question I decided to take a different approach and reach out to different well known breeders to seek information from some of the big names in the industry. I was very pleased when all of them responded.

So I formulated the question "I have a quick question for you. What is the best method of long term seed storage? Fridge or Freezer? Mylar bags or food saver plastic? Oxygen absorbers or none? Moisture Absorbers or none. Vacuum Sealed or just closed? Your expertise is appreciated."

Csi Humbold wrote me back:
Fridge is good for 10 years +/-, Freezer is great for 20+ years. I prefer black mylar bags and don't use anything else with excellent results. Vacuum sealed for freezer, just closed for fridge, as those seeds I get into from time to time. I asked if I should use the moisture absorbers and moisture absorbers... CSI Humboldt replied "if you double bag seeds, I would use those in the outer bag and not in with the seeds. I've seen folks overdue it with dessicants when storing seeds.

Hazeman Replied: Vacuum Seal, no moisture if you use the freezer. Then when you take them out let them get to room temperature before you open them. I also keep other seeds in the fridge in plastic bags.

Jaws Genetics Replied: (Not Jaws but one of his associates on his account). "Me and my friends usually just use the fridge. My friend has seeds that are still good from 10 years ago and just keep them in the fridge. But I know some people do all the different things you listed. I would recommend asking the question to a few others before making your choice. Don't forget the option of tissue culture techniques to revive really old seeds. Some may not pop with regular methods but you always have that method.

Swamiseed replied: Make sure they are dry and put them in vacuum sealed packs with desiccant packs, then freeze them.

MzJill replied: Hi There, a lot of people do it different ways. Some people put them in a freezer bag bagged up several times so they don't get moisture. You don't want the temperature to go up and down if you keep them in the freezer. Personnally with TGA we always just kept them in sealed glass jars in a air conditioned basement room (**edited slightly for details privacy). So just Dark, airtight and cool.

I also asked Subcool and he responded, but somehow his account on IG disappeared or at least the conversation did so I don't have the details, but I believe he also said the same thing as cool, dry and airtight.

------------------------
Anyhow I was very appreciative these well known breeders were able to share their expert advice with me. It seems like the common theme is: Dry, airtight, dark and cool. Moisture is not good. Very nice of them to take their time out to answer my questions! Love our industry/culture!

Since I don't have a vacuum sealer, what I will be doing is putting each variety of seeds in a 4x6 black mylar bag with a label on the outside as well as writing the details of the strain breed inside the mylar bag on a piece of paper. Inside the 4x6 mylar bag the seeds will be in their plastic ziplock bags (dimebags). Then each seed "project" I will take all of the 4x6 mylar bags and put them inside of a large 12" x 12" mylar bag, which will have a couple moisture absorbents and oxygen absorbents. I may try to seal the mylar bag with a clothes iron but I think with the multiple packages and ziplocks I think they will be ok, especially with the desiccants.

I still haven't decided if I am going to put them in the freezer or the fridge. I think the freezer probably gets opened less and stays at a constant temperature more often than my fridge so most likely I will put them in the freezer. I am actually looking for a 2nd hand little mini fridge or even a controlled temp wine rack or beverage freezer if I can find one that sits right about freezing and doesn't run up my electric too much.

Anyhow, hopefully everyone can benefit from this info!!! I really appreciate all the breeders who commented back to me and answered my questions. That is awesome!!!







 

seedlingmtl

Well-Known Member
Seed Storage: How to keep your seeds viable for many years.
Input from well known breeders in the industry:


So now that I have a nice seed collection building and all of this hard work has been going into preserving my beloved genetics and creating new strains, my biggest concern was "how do I store these seeds to ensure long term viability" and so that I don't see my time and effort go to waste.

I went to Am@zon and ordered myself some oxygen absorbing packets, some moisture dessicants to absorb moisture, and 3 different sizes of ziplock mylar bags. Currently my method of storage was small "dime bags" inside of mailing envelopes labeled and put in a rubbermaid bin which was kept at room temperature in my closet (no AC so some days get very hot). I knew this was not the best way to store them so I decided to get some answers:

I will admit, generally for things like this I will scour the internet for hours looking at science abstracts and all available information to make a good generalization about what is the best way to do things, however with this question I decided to take a different approach and reach out to different well known breeders to seek information from some of the big names in the industry. I was very pleased when all of them responded.

So I formulated the question "I have a quick question for you. What is the best method of long term seed storage? Fridge or Freezer? Mylar bags or food saver plastic? Oxygen absorbers or none? Moisture Absorbers or none. Vacuum Sealed or just closed? Your expertise is appreciated."

Csi Humbold wrote me back: Fridge is good for 10 years +/-, Freezer is great for 20+ years. I prefer black mylar bags and don't use anything else with excellent results. Vacuum sealed for freezer, just closed for fridge, as those seeds I get into from time to time. I asked if I should use the moisture absorbers and moisture absorbers... CSI Humboldt replied "if you double bag seeds, I would use those in the outer bag and not in with the seeds. I've seen folks overdue it with dessicants when storing seeds.

Hazeman Replied: Vacuum Seal, no moisture if you use the freezer. Then when you take them out let them get to room temperature before you open them. I also keep other seeds in the fridge in plastic bags.

Jaws Genetics Replied: (Not Jaws but one of his associates on his account). "Me and my friends usually just use the fridge. My friend has seeds that are still good from 10 years ago and just keep them in the fridge. But I know some people do all the different things you listed. I would recommend asking the question to a few others before making your choice. Don't forget the option of tissue culture techniques to revive really old seeds. Some may not pop with regular methods but you always have that method.

Swamiseed replied: Make sure they are dry and put them in vacuum sealed packs with desiccant packs, then freeze them.

MzJill replied: Hi There, a lot of people do it different ways. Some people put them in a freezer bag bagged up several times so they don't get moisture. You don't want the temperature to go up and down if you keep them in the freezer. Personnally with TGA we always just kept them in sealed glass jars in a air conditioned basement room (**edited slightly for details privacy). So just Dark, airtight and cool.

I also asked Subcool and he responded, but somehow his account on IG disappeared or at least the conversation did so I don't have the details, but I believe he also said the same thing as cool, dry and airtight.

------------------------
Anyhow I was very appreciative these well known breeders were able to share their expert advice with me. It seems like the common theme is: Dry, airtight, dark and cool. Moisture is not good. Very nice of them to take their time out to answer my questions! Love our industry/culture!

Since I don't have a vacuum sealer, what I will be doing is putting each variety of seeds in a 4x6 black mylar bag with a label on the outside as well as writing the details of the strain breed inside the mylar bag on a piece of paper. Inside the 4x6 mylar bag the seeds will be in their plastic ziplock bags (dimebags). Then each seed "project" I will take all of the 4x6 mylar bags and put them inside of a large 12" x 12" mylar bag, which will have a couple moisture absorbents and oxygen absorbents. I may try to seal the mylar bag with a clothes iron but I think with the multiple packages and ziplocks I think they will be ok, especially with the desiccants.

I still haven't decided if I am going to put them in the freezer or the fridge. I think the freezer probably gets opened less and stays at a constant temperature more often than my fridge so most likely I will put them in the freezer. I am actually looking for a 2nd hand little mini fridge or even a controlled temp wine rack or beverage freezer if I can find one that sits right about freezing and doesn't run up my electric too much.

Anyhow, hopefully everyone can benefit from this info!!! I really appreciate all the breeders who commented back to me and answered my questions. That is awesome!!!
I was reading somewhere on here about storage and I think it was @neikodog that mentioned using rice as moisture control. Good read, love this journal! Thanks for your efforts mud
 

Pennywise

Member of the Year: 2017 - Member of the Month: Mar & Oct 2017, Aug 2018, May 2019 - Plant of the Month: Aug 2017

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
I was reading somewhere on here about storage and I think it was @neikodog that mentioned using rice as moisture control. Good read, love this journal! Thanks for your efforts mud
Ive heard about Rice being used as well. Thanks for the compliments! definitely glad to share good information when I get it :)
 

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Nice tutorial on keeping seeds.
Thanks Pennywise! I figured why not go to some respected breeders to find out how they do it. Seems they all were pretty similar replies... cold, dry and thats about it :)
 

Pennywise

Member of the Year: 2017 - Member of the Month: Mar & Oct 2017, Aug 2018, May 2019 - Plant of the Month: Aug 2017

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
And little or no oxygen.
Yep, that too :) been a long day of compliance details, packaging compliance and regulations... lol... I think I'm ready for a bowl!
 

Pennywise

Member of the Year: 2017 - Member of the Month: Mar & Oct 2017, Aug 2018, May 2019 - Plant of the Month: Aug 2017

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Already did a bowl of PC getting ready to Avengers. Lol
Sweet!!!! That sounds rad! just signed out of my work for the day... so time to enjoy some sweet green herbals :)
 

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Hey everyone.. Sorry for the delayed update. Work has been extremely hectic the last few weeks as we get closer to getting into our new facility we are building (volatile extraction). I'm the compliance manager so pretty much all aspects of the business I have my hands in at some point or another which is great for job security, but definitely takes its toll on me mentally.

Anyhow back to whats important... Breeding! haha

So today makes day 29 of flowering (from the flip to 12/12) and things are really looking good in the Bangi Haze pollen chuck project!

All 4 of the males were putting out tons and tons of pollen which was nice for making sure all of the females received the pollen, but it was so much that yesterday I chopped the males down and removed them from the tent. I took each male, slowly cut a branch off, and shook it inside of a ziplock freezer bag to knock off as much pollen as I could. I then took all leaves off and placed the remaining branch and pollen sacks into a plastic grocery bag to let them dry out, in which then I will strip all of the pollen sacks off and try to collect as much pollen as possible.

I then re-arranged the tent to give the girls more "elbow room" in the tent, and did some mild pruning of lower fan leave to help my tent have better air circulation and light penetration.

The bangi hazes are coming along very nicely and just starting to develop trichomes. The structure is really starting to stack on each bud however I haven't really noticed any really potent smell from them. Its more of a light lemony smell, but not extremely potent yet (which is fairly normal in mid flowering still). The plants themselves look a lot like my trainwreck which is very interesting.

Now for the next month I will just continue to feed them, and watch them as their seeds mature and they grow. I am really hoping they turn out into something special as everything I read says its an energetic high, very good for productivity and even a tad bit psychedelic (supposedly)

Not much else to report, so here are some photos:

Full Tent View:




Males: (before and mid chop):







Bangi Haze F9 females








 

Van Stank

Member of the Month: Nov 2017 - Plant of the Month: June 2018, November 2018 - Plant of the Year: 2018 - Plant of the Month: Sept 2019
Tent is looking good brother. Love the look of that male and him stacking. Nice show man! :thumb: :popcorn:
 

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Hey Everyone!!!!

Wanted to do a quick update on the Apollo 13 F4 project that is in veg right now.

All is looking really good and I have to say I love the leaves on the Apollo 13's... So cool looking with the jagged leaf blades!

I did discover last week that 1 single leaf on one of the apollo 13th had been attacked by Thrips. I've dealt with Thrips a few times over the years, never a serious issue as they are pretty easy to get rid of. I think that they somehow either come through my window screens or maybe when I open my front door and notice they are attracted to lights. Anyhow I sprayed all the girls with a blend of R/O water, neem oil, spinosad and some SNS 209 and added some calcium nitrate and microblast (micronutrients) just to feed the girls while also treating them. I removed the single leaf that was affected as well.

On the feeding I did a few days after the foliar treatment I added some spinosad to the nutrient mix, as spinosad can be used systemically through the roots according to a study on tomatoes and rockwool I read a couple years back. So far I haven't seen any new "thrip marks" and will probably do a repeat foliar treatment this week to make sure that any eggs that may have emerged or any thrips hanging around are taken care of. Usually it only takes 1 or 2 treatments and they don't come back so should be fine from here on out. Preventative spraying in veg is never a bad idea either just to prevent them later, as in flowering they are much harder to treat for because they like to hang out in the buds too.

Anyhow, other than that, not much else to report on at this time, so here are some photos of the Apollo 13s.



 

Pennywise

Member of the Year: 2017 - Member of the Month: Mar & Oct 2017, Aug 2018, May 2019 - Plant of the Month: Aug 2017

Icemud

Member of the Month: July 2012, July 2014 - Nug of the Month: July 2012
Those Apollo are cool looking plants, hope you got all the thrips.
Thanks Pennywise! Yea Thrips are pretty easy to get rid of as long as you get them early. I inspected all my leaves and only 1 leaf was actually affected so I caught them at the right time. I probably will do another foliar feeding this evenening and add some SNS and neem to the foliar just to make sure the thrips are gone for good. I definitely am glad that Thrips generally are the only pest I usually see in my garden other than an occasional spider which I leave in with the plants :)
So much easier to deal with Thrips than other pests. I still always wonder how they get into my tents because the tents stay closed unless I am feeding the plants... even when leaving the house, I am careful to open and close the door quickly and not leave it open to minimize the chance of pests getting in.

Definitely love how these apollo 13's look, and they smell great already which makes me excited about how they will flower out :) Happy Friday my friend!
 

Pennywise

Member of the Year: 2017 - Member of the Month: Mar & Oct 2017, Aug 2018, May 2019 - Plant of the Month: Aug 2017
I run the Xmas Bud from CSI and there are mutants that have those crazy jagged leaves. May be the same gene or something close.
 
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