Thirvnrob's Canuck Seeds Double Chocolate/Acapulco Gold Comparative Grow

[CharlieWaffles]

137 out of the tap & 161 out of the filter. I’m gonna run some more water through the new filter and measure again, but either way it’s way too high.

Maybe I missed something along the way, but why would anything in the 100 - 200 range be too high? What’s in your water that you’re so worried about? Mine comes out of the tap around 50 but a friend of mine who operates a greenhouse told me he doesn’t worry about it as long as it’s under 200, or at least I think that’s what he told me.

 

[Gee64]

I suppose I may as well bring up the water itself. Here goes. I bought a water filtration kit and hung it on my back porch. I’ll see if I can find a picture, but anyway, it filters sediments and chlorine/chloramine. Shed and I were talking about PPM a couple days ago and he asked what the PPM is out of the faucet but my TDS meter was acting up. It really frustrated me & I just said the hell with worrying about it. Two days later occurred to me that the battery might need to be replaced.


So now I’m more confused than ever. The PPM out of the tap is actually lower than the filtered water. I changed the filter and still got the same reading. Operator error is usually my first suspicion, but using a TDS meter isn’t exactly rocket science. I wonder if I have the right sediment filter? Also, would a reverse osmosis system require being hardwired or could I plug it into a surge protector?
I’m starting a pot of coffee now in case @Gee64 chimes in…

Haha! Tough crowd. Well you get pictures instead of words this time Bucko!

I bought an RO system like this one. It doesn't have a holding tank and it hangs from the wall on 2 screws.

I bought it from these guys in Texas. Excellent service on the phone, they know their stuff and are very helpful. I told him what I wanted to do and he suggested one of these....

A garden hose intake attachment, so it's plug and play as the faucet was already there, then a couple connection fittings for this...

Way too much line to run from the filter, through a couple walls, and into my grow room. Once in the grow room it empties into a 100 litre tote that has a float valve inlet that they also suggested and sold me.

I can't remember the price but I think it was about US$175 before shipping and dollar difference to Canada. They sell replacement filters as well. It was 5 or 6 years ago, so the price may be higher now.

If I recall my filter is actually called a 3 stage countertop filter, or something close to that.

It comes out at near-zero ppm.

 

[CharlieWaffles]

Haha! Tough crowd. Well you get pictures instead of words this time Bucko!

I bought an RO system like this one. It doesn't have a holding tank and it hangs from the wall on 2 screws.

I bought it from these guys in Texas. Excellent service on the phone, they know their stuff and are very helpful. I told him what I wanted to do and he suggested one of these....

A garden hose intake attachment, so it's plug and play as the faucet was already there, then a couple connection fittings for this...

Way too much line to run from the filter, through a couple walls, and into my grow room. Once in the grow room it empties into a 100 litre tote that has a float valve inlet that they also suggested and sold me.

I can't remember the price but I think it was about US$175 before shipping and dollar difference to Canada. They sell replacement filters as well. It was 5 or 6 years ago, so the price may be higher now.

If I recall my filter is actually called a 3 stage countertop filter, or something close to that.

It comes out at near-zero ppm.

Nice set up! Especially for the price.

 

[Thirvnrob]

Haha! Tough crowd. Well you get pictures instead of words this time Bucko!

I bought an RO system like this one. It doesn't have a holding tank and it hangs from the wall on 2 screws.

I bought it from these guys in Texas. Excellent service on the phone, they know their stuff and are very helpful. I told him what I wanted to do and he suggested one of these....

A garden hose intake attachment, so it's plug and play as the faucet was already there, then a couple connection fittings for this...

Way too much line to run from the filter, through a couple walls, and into my grow room. Once in the grow room it empties into a 100 litre tote that has a float valve inlet that they also suggested and sold me.

I can't remember the price but I think it was about US$175 before shipping and dollar difference to Canada. They sell replacement filters as well. It was 5 or 6 years ago, so the price may be higher now.

If I recall my filter is actually called a 3 stage countertop filter, or something close to that.

It comes out at near-zero ppm.

I need words, man! I made a whole pot of coffee! I do have a question about RO water. Is it necessary? Due to my laziness & desire to follow the path of least resistance, I prefer to find a proper sediment filter that will fit my canisters. Those look like they may fit! I'm calling them tomorrow!

 

[Thirvnrob]

Maybe I missed something along the way, but why would anything in the 100 - 200 range be too high? What’s in your water that you’re so worried about? Mine comes out of the tap around 50 but a friend of mine who operates a greenhouse told me he doesn’t worry about it as long as it’s under 200, or at least I think that’s what he told me.

I can't answer that question with a lot of confidence but I know some guys who can. I think it has to do with the amendments I've added to the soil & keeping those ratios in balance. @Gee64 @StoneOtter @Azimuth @Keffka What say you? (Gee may need a break)...

 

[Azimuth]

@Gee64 Talk a little about cal-mag for the soil vs for the plant.

I'd imagine @StoneOtter 's practice of adding only through the reservoir is good for the plant but probably doesn't do much for the magnetic effect in the soil especially since calcium is so heavy that it is hard to lift through capillary action?

And if this is true, then his thought of adding dolomite lime throughout his soil might lead to needing less liquid cal-mag down the pipe?

 

[Gee64]

@Gee64 Talk a little about cal-mag for the soil vs for the plant.

I'd imagine @StoneOtter 's practice of adding only through the reservoir is good for the plant but probably doesn't do much for the magnetic effect in the soil especially since calcium is so heavy that it is hard to lift through capillary action?

And if this is true, then his thought of adding dolomite lime throughout his soil might lead to needing less liquid cal-mag down the pipe?

I would guess that if capilliary action brings up water that it will bring up calcium with it.

That's actually why I suggested a long time ago in your thread that filling the res thru the soil, not the fill pipe, may work well if you never overflow the res. The calcium would cycle from EWC to the res and then back up.

Maybe this is a clearer explanation. In top watering, calcium is always pushed down and its heavy so it moves relatively quick, so you put EWC up top to replace the global soil mix that has been pushed down and out, as well as eaten by the plant.

In a SIP, the calcium moves down far slower, but with never adding more, it will all get eaten eventually so the soil still loses out.

Rob's Rev mix may very well make it all the way thru if he never overflows the res, and lets it dry briefly between fills, just brief enough to ensure that any calcium falling out can get re-used, not settled on the bottom of the res.

With a refractometer you will see the calcium deficiency coming, so if you have to add calmag you will know when.

I can't answer that question with a lot of confidence but I know some guys who can. I think it has to do with the amendments I've added to the soil & keeping those ratios in balance. @Gee64 @StoneOtter @Azimuth @Keffka What say you? (Gee may need a break)...

It does have to do with your ammendments but if you never rebuild your soil it's far less detrimental, but if it's too heavy in one mineral, such as magnesium or chloramine, it could lead to problems.

As long as you know what the ppm is, you can probably work with it. RO water takes the guess work out of it.

How wet was/is the soil in the 2 with issues?

 

[Thirvnrob]

I'm recycling my first batch of soil & The Rev's instructions include a sidebar on adjusting certain components if ppm is above a certain number in the water you'll be using which is the one & only reason I had any semblance of a clue.

The one in the 5 gal was fairly dry on the very top - crusty then dusty (like talc) after I scratched it up. The 10 gal was a little wetter, but neither of them felt too wet.

As a temporary measure until I (we) get this figured out I might just go back to buying my water for a week or so.

I tried to use my refractometer several days ago without success. I might need to re-caibrate it, but I also have trouble collecting "juice" to refractometerate . What the hell does it take to squeeze out a drop?
I'll try recalibrating it tomorrow & if I can find a starting point I'll go back & look at your post about how to read it correctly, but I need to know how to get that drop of canna juice too...

 

[Azimuth]

I'll try recalibrating it tomorrow & if I can find a starting point I'll go back & look at your post about how to read it correctly, but I need to know how to get that drop of canna juice too...

@Graytail 's How to Take Brix Measurements

 

[Gee64]

I'm recycling my first batch of soil & The Rev's instructions include a sidebar on adjusting certain components if ppm is above a certain number in the water you'll be using which is the one & only reason I had any semblance of a clue.

The one in the 5 gal was fairly dry on the very top - crusty then dusty (like talc) after I scratched it up. The 10 gal was a little wetter, but neither of them felt too wet.

As a temporary measure until I (we) get this figured out I might just go back to buying my water for a week or so.

I tried to use my refractometer several days ago without success. I might need to re-caibrate it, but I also have trouble collecting "juice" to refractometerate . What the hell does it take to squeeze out a drop?
I'll try recalibrating it tomorrow & if I can find a starting point I'll go back & look at your post about how to read it correctly, but I need to know how to get that drop of canna juice too...

roll a leaf or 2 into a nice tight ball, placed it between 2 nickels, and squish it with vice grips. You will get juice.

Here are 2 images I downloaded from google. The top one has a very crisp defined line. Calcium is really low.

The bottom one is very fuzzy, calcium is perfect.

 

[Thirvnrob]

roll a leaf or 2 into a nice tight ball, placed it between 2 nickels, and squish it with vice grips. You will get juice.

Here are 2 images I downloaded from google. The top one has a very crisp defined line. Calcium is really low.

The bottom one is very fuzzy, calcium is perfect.

Brix is 11 in the second pic?

 

[Thirvnrob]

@Graytail 's How to Take Brix Measurements

Thanks Azi! Everyone else too! I appreciate you guys sharing this stuff with me.

 

[Gee64]

Brix is 11 in the second pic

I would say roughly 10. They are just random pics, I wanted to show you how the lines differ.

 

[StoneOtter]

I bought the same ones you have as soon as you posted your setup but I only ordered two & then two more when I got the light. One was on backorder & didn't arrive till a few days ago. I kept packing the corners as I filled the pot which may explain why they might be wetter. Or not...

I did the same. May be the soil makeup itself, how it wicks maybe, or if you top watered at all. Very interesting and cool! I wish my top roots looked like that!

 

[StoneOtter]

Here's my understanding of why I need to use ro water.
I run Rev TLO LOS soil and after reading the book my conclusion today is that his soil is race car rich and I have to keep additional minerals down for balance. Most or all others don't need to run it as far as I know.

What Shed said about ro being wasteful is true and I bucked it for a while but since it's our medicine I went for it. If you see a cord, it's the wrong one like mine with a light for killing bacteria that we want. Could be a pump. Also mine has a calcium source that makes 25 ppm output. So 2 things wrong with my choice. I just don't plug in and 25 ppm is not the end of the world. I should reconfig the unit but the list is long and it's low on it.

 

[Thirvnrob]

today is day 51 above ground. Yesterday I removed the scrog - it was in the way & not tall enough anyway. After that I defoliated but not as heavy handed as I usually do. I was relieved to get that done as I was worried about WPM. I was finding big drops of water on the leaves almost daily, but only on the Double Chocolate. The AG never showed that although they’re quite bushy as well. I’m still (obviously) not good at troubleshooting, but I’ve learned a good bit in the last couple days. I hope I can retain it.
Here they are today. I really have my heart set on flipping soon, so hopefully the spotting issue is resolved. I’ve been scrutinizing the leaves daily, & I didn’t notice any new spotting today. I am however, willing to wait & be sure I’m sending healthy plants into flower.

The Acapulco Gold are the bigger girls. The Double Chocolate are beautiful ladies, but much smaller.
Even with the stress of figuring out what the hell is going on with the Acapulco Gold, I’m loving this grow. Maybe it’s because of the stress that I’m loving it. It’s providing a better kind of drama…

I’m trying to employ @InTheShed ’s super cropping technique to keep the last one even at the top. I thought I had taken a better canopy shot. You can’t see it in any of these photos but one of the DC has a cola with a strong desire to be apical…

 

[Absorber]

today is day 51 above ground. Yesterday I removed the scrog - it was in the way & not tall enough anyway. After that I defoliated but not as heavy handed as I usually do. I was relieved to get that done as I was worried about WPM. I was finding big drops of water on the leaves almost daily, but only on the Double Chocolate. The AG never showed that although they’re quite bushy as well. I’m still (obviously) not good at troubleshooting, but I’ve learned a good bit in the last couple days. I hope I can retain it.
Here they are today. I really have my heart set on flipping soon, so hopefully the spotting issue is resolved. I’ve been scrutinizing the leaves daily, & I didn’t notice any new spotting today. I am however, willing to wait & be sure I’m sending healthy plants into flower.

The Acapulco Gold are the bigger girls. The Double Chocolate are beautiful ladies, but much smaller.
Even with the stress of figuring out what the hell is going on with the Acapulco Gold, I’m loving this grow. Maybe it’s because of the stress that I’m loving it. It’s providing a better kind of drama…

I’m trying to employ @InTheShed ’s super cropping technique to keep the last one even at the top. I thought I had taken a better canopy shot. You can’t see it in any of these photos but one of the DC has a cola with a strong desire to be apical…

Nice size i look forwardto the flip , have you used any CalMag yet? They look as if they need a little the brown patches on the leaves is usually a sign of it
I love your grow so far

 

[Thirvnrob]

Nice size i look forwardto the flip , have you used any CalMag yet? They look as if they need a little the brown patches on the leaves is usually a sign of it
I love your grow so far

Thanks, I’m pretty happy with it myself, spotting notwithstanding.
I’ve been giving them CalMag pretty regularly. If you care to, scroll back a little bit. @Gee64 delved pretty deeply into the likely cause of the spotting & possible solutions…

 

[Thirvnrob]

Here's my understanding of why I need to use ro water.
I run Rev TLO LOS soil and after reading the book my conclusion today is that his soil is race car rich and I have to keep additional minerals down for balance. Most or all others don't need to run it as far as I know.

What Shed said about ro being wasteful is true and I bucked it for a while but since it's our medicine I went for it. If you see a cord, it's the wrong one like mine with a light for killing bacteria that we want. Could be a pump. Also mine has a calcium source that makes 25 ppm output. So 2 things wrong with my choice. I just don't plug in and 25 ppm is not the end of the world. I should reconfig the unit but the list is long and it's low on it.

I need clarification - does reverse osmosis affect ppm?

 

[CaptainLucky]

I need clarification - does reverse osmosis affect ppm?

Tbh I really don’t know , however it is a form of filtration so I would guess it does. CL