SIP Club - Getting Hydro/Coco Results In A Soil Based Medium

[Buds Buddy]

But I'm still confused as to how this should work as air gap.. with a perforated top that gives access to the soil? how do you prevent roots from growing straight into the water where you have to end up putting in an airstone to prevent stagnation and root rot and now you're in dwc territory..

Or how about that autopot base, that indeed keeps feeding with a valve but what if I place two root pouches on that with the bottom 2 inch filled with hydropebbles and perlite and then soil so that provides an oxygen rich wicking environment?

The roots self prune or just stop growing at the top of the res. Why? I don't know. But they do not grow down into the res. I'm guessing that the Air Gap between the soil & the water causes it. The perforated platform for instance is 6" high. The drain hole in your bucket is 4" high. So you can only add 4" of water / feed. That creates a 2" Air Gap between the Soil & the water.

 

[Azimuth]

But I'm still confused as to how this should work as air gap.. with a perforated top that gives access to the soil? how do you prevent roots from growing straight into the water where you have to end up putting in an airstone to prevent stagnation and root rot and now you're in dwc territory..

Or how about that autopot base, that indeed keeps feeding with a valve but what if I place two root pouches on that with the bottom 2 inch filled with hydropebbles and perlite and then soil so that provides an oxygen rich wicking environment?

Don't overthink it. Get started with one of the tried and true simple designs. If an air stone were needed we would have found that by now. Seriously, trust the process. Run a basic version that many have had great success with first and then experiment to your heart's content.

 

[bluter]

looks like a great system if you run one space from seed to finish as well.
are most starting the seedlings in a traditional fashion then up potting to the sip ?

 

[Fenderbender]

The roots self prune or just stop growing at the top of the res. Why? I don't know. But they do not grow down into the res. I'm guessing that the Air Gap between the soil & the water causes it. The perforated platform for instance is 6" high. The drain hole in your bucket is 4" high. So you can only add 4" of water / feed. That creates a 2" Air Gap between the Soil & the water.

maybe because there's no top drip.. if water was dripping over the top and back into the reservoir the roots can use that to skip any airgap and grow into the nutrients.. that's how I ended up with this

 

[Azimuth]

looks like a great system if you run one space from seed to finish as well.
are most starting the seedlings in a traditional fashion then up potting to the sip ?

That's what we are working on now. Specifically what is the best way to start a SIP. There seems to be a 2-3 week lag time for the plant to transition enough to benefit from the moister environment.

I've planted a seed directly into its final container and it looked droopy and overwatered for a couple of weeks but then took off and holy crap! That thing was the healthiest most robust plant I've ever grown.

I just recently up-potted an older clone that took to the environment straight away, but it did spend time growing before I moved it in to the SIP. So, there does seem to be some amount of upfront time to transition, and the challenge now is how to best dial it in.

 

[bluter]

That's what we are working on now. Specifically what is the best way to start a SIP. There seems to be a 2-3 week lag time for the plant to transition enough to benefit from the moister environment.

I've planted a seed directly into its final container and it looked droopy and overwatered for a couple of weeks but then took off and holy crap! That thing was the healthiest most robust plant I've ever grown.

I just recently up-potted an older clone that took to the environment straight away, but it did spend time growing before I moved it in to the SIP. So, there does seem to be some amount of upfront time to transition, and the challenge now is how to best dial it in.

it's similar to hempy and other types of hydro with a res. it takes some time for the plant to hook up. the roots have to either hit the res or get close before they surge. it's nothing new, you see it in all sorts of systems.

 

[farside05]

Day 14

Tomorrow I'll probably have to add some water to the reservoir. So far, so good. They look happy and stout. 2nd OGesus bean appears to be a non starter too. Given that 4 was probably overkill in the tent to begin with, I'll just continue on with 3 from here.

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• farside05
• Nov 6, 2022

 

[Azimuth]

it's similar to hempy and other types of hydro with a res. it takes some time for the plant to hook up. the roots have to either hit the res or get close before they surge. it's nothing new, you see it in all sorts of systems.

I think that's right. The question is, if pressed for time and growing from seed, is it better to start right off in the final container or spend some development time in a smaller pot first.

To me it's probably a push at best and I'd start it straight away in the final pot and try the low waterings strategy for the first couple of weeks to ease it in. I think that's what @Buds Buddy does with his.

 

[Pete Detroit]

Hey everyone… here’s my addition to the SIP club. She just broke soil this morning. I followed @Buds Buddy process of watering roughly 1 gallon the day before and then planting. She’s a White Widow Auto. Let’s see if I can keep from killing her! I have not filled the reservoir yet but there’s a lot of damp soil still from first watering. 2 questions: when should I fill the reservoir up? And when it’s time to fill it, should I fill it all the way or just half way? Thanks for the help!

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 30, 2022
• blackberry kush

Kooshie, looks like elevating / dimming the light cured the 'tip burn' issue

Personally, I leave the res empty until they get a good three nodes on 'em. Then I fill the res. One of my plants (Kooshie) had one seried of leaves that got "Crepey" (wrinkled) which seems to be a symptom of over water? Rapidly cleared up, tho.

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 30, 2022
• blackberry kush

Kooshie, looks like elevating / dimming the light cured the 'tip burn' issue

 

[Pete Detroit]

MAN this thread has TONS of activity!
So, Azi commented on my post, he'd like to see the construction process - Thought I linked to the thread (also at Grow #2, in my sig) but I can just post the pix.
I started with drilling holes in the bucket. I think the holes in the top provide the magic air gap. NOT illustrated, holes bored in the main bucket about 5" up (to correlate w/ the top of the rez) to act as a drain if overfilled, and allow air infiltration. Same size as the little holes in the can, Prolly about 3/16". PVC had a slight angle at one end, so after gluing it up, left it inside the bucket to prop it up, not having a good way to clamp it. Strong joint? No, but it doesn't really need to be. Ok, 24 hours to let that cure, same process to glue the funnel into the tube. When THAT dried, buried the rex in perlite (Note to self, weak one of those stupid masks!). Blend a little soil in to smooth the transition, fill w dirt (adding a dose of DynoMyco 1/2 way up. Plant (Blackberry Kush, calling her Kooshie) followed my standard sprouting process. Top watered her for a week or so, until I deemed she was big enough, and I filled the tank. She jumped 50% over night.
2nd bucket was similar (no extra pix), slightly different funnel that was cheaper, Maxwell coffee can (Flatter bottom, stiffer lip - easier to drill) was a vast improvement. Volume of the cans is a little over 2L

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

The pieces - some assembly required

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

Vent, fill hole in bottom (top) of can

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

Pilot, "vent" holes in sides

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

Assembly complete!

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

Cork "float"

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

Stirring some soil into the perlite "wicking media"

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022

Adding a layer of DynoMyco

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 3, 2022
• blackberry kush

All Done!

Sun 10/16

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 16, 2022
• blackberry kush

After first trim, you can just see the new branching at top
And today, 10/17 - I'm shocked, SHOCKED I tell you!

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• Pete Detroit
• Oct 17, 2022
• blackberry kush

Monday, 10/17 - I think she's doubled in 24 hours...

 

[Pete Detroit]

Oddly enough, even just sitting in a deep (ish) pan of water can give SIP results. To recap, had a 5 gal rig, standard config, drain holes bored in the bottom, layer of gravel, fill w/ soil. add plant. After one plant died, I repotted her using the soil from dead plant's bucket to give this one more root space... (and had issues - see link "What a disaster!") At any rate, few weeks after THAT, decided to try a hybrid SIP conversion - basically, just bored "Breathing Holes" around the pot about 3 - 4 in up (the same 3/16 or what ever size bit I'm using for all the small holes) plopped it in a deep pan, filled it up. She took OFF. Today, after 4th week of bloom she's drinking 3 - 4 L / day (turns out she has help, cat likes her water better than his...) is roughly 4x4 and freaking COVERED with colas up to 9"...

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• Pete Detroit
• Sep 15, 2022
• gold leaf

More training for Goldie

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• Pete Detroit
• Sep 18, 2022
• #gold leaf

Goldie, Exploding

In just 3 days, noticably taller, fuller...

And today, 5 weeks from flip, 4 weeks into bloom...

IMG20221106121734.jpg

• Pete Detroit
• Nov 6, 2022
• gold leaf

Goldie, The Monster, 4x4 and prolly 4 ft + tall, covered w/ buds

IMG20221106121801.jpg

• Pete Detroit
• Nov 6, 2022
• gold leaf

9" colas, getting fat and sticky

IMG20221106121842.jpg

• Pete Detroit
• Nov 6, 2022
• gold leaf

close up of a cola

 

[CBDMed]

Oddly enough, even just sitting in a deep (ish) pan of water can give SIP results. To recap, had a 5 gal rig, standard config, drain holes bored in the bottom, layer of gravel, fill w/ soil. add plant. After one plant died, I repotted her using the soil from dead plant's bucket to give this one more root space... (and had issues - see link "What a disaster!") At any rate, few weeks after THAT, decided to try a hybrid SIP conversion - basically, just bored "Breathing Holes" around the pot about 3 - 4 in up (the same 3/16 or what ever size bit I'm using for all the small holes) plopped it in a deep pan, filled it up. She took OFF. Today, after 4th week of bloom she's drinking 3 - 4 L / day (turns out she has help, cat likes her water better than his...) is roughly 4x4 and freaking COVERED with colas up to 9"...

IMG_2060.JPG​

• Pete Detroit
• Sep 15, 2022
• gold leaf

More training for Goldie

IMG_2067.JPG​

• Pete Detroit
• Sep 18, 2022
• #gold leaf

Goldie, Exploding

In just 3 days, noticably taller, fuller...

And today, 5 weeks from flip, 4 weeks into bloom...

IMG20221106121734.jpg

• Pete Detroit
• Nov 6, 2022
• gold leaf

Goldie, The Monster, 4x4 and prolly 4 ft + tall, covered w/ buds

IMG20221106121801.jpg

• Pete Detroit
• Nov 6, 2022
• gold leaf

9" colas, getting fat and sticky

IMG20221106121842.jpg

• Pete Detroit
• Nov 6, 2022
• gold leaf

close up of a cola

Curioser and curiouser!
Thanks for sharing that.
Cool hairdo.

 

[Pete Detroit]

Curioser and curiouser!
Thanks for sharing that.
Cool hairdo.

Agreed. Talk about stupid EASY / Effective. Every welcome, kind of the point of this thread, discuss different methods / equipment, and results! and the 'air holes' are prolly 3 in apart, all the way around
Hairdo, on the Llama? Yeah, he looks like a surfer dude... cracks me up!

 

[CBDMed]

Agreed. Talk about stupid EASY / Effective. Every welcome, kind of the point of this thread, discuss different methods / equipment, and results! and the 'air holes' are prolly 3 in apart, all the way around
Hairdo, on the Llama? Yeah, he looks like a surfer dude... cracks me up!

 

[Buds Buddy]

I think that's right. The question is, if pressed for time and growing from seed, is it better to start right off in the final container or spend some development time in a smaller pot first.

To me it's probably a push at best and I'd start it straight away in the final pot and try the low waterings strategy for the first couple of weeks to ease it in. I think that's what @Buds Buddy does with his.

I usually start my seeds in a 1 gal. pot. Once in a while I start them in the final pot; like I'm trying this time. I wanted to see how it works out first hand in SIP's & if I should skip the 1 gal. pot from now on.

 

[Azimuth]

So, Azi commented on my post, he'd like to see the construction process - Thought I linked to the thread (also at Grow #2, in my sig) but I can just post the pix.

Thanks, Pete!

And the purpose of the cork float?

 

[Buds Buddy]

maybe because there's no top drip.. if water was dripping over the top and back into the reservoir the roots can use that to skip any airgap and grow into the nutrients.. that's how I ended up with this

Now we know why it says to "Never Top Water". Also explains why I get a few roots that grow down the side by the res Air Hole opening. Nowhere else. Just there. Worried it could clog the drain hole.

 

[StoneOtter]

 

[gazmufc]

Don't overthink it. Get started with one of the tried and true simple designs. If an air stone were needed we would have found that by now. Seriously, trust the process. Run a basic version that many have had great success with first and then experiment to your heart's content.

Hey Azimuth,

Was chatting to u few weeks ago, ur were kind enough to give me good advice on watering. 2 weeks on and my plants are looking much better. They have had x2 dry periods now, with it taking 5 days in between watering. They are actually praying all the time now and ai ntoce new growth every day. Thanks..


I'm defo interested in trying this SIP set for my next grow. Looking to make my own to reduce cost a little. Found this video here were the dude uses a cotton shirt in the hole at the bottom. Would it be OK to use this for cannabis, or is it better to just use a smaller grow pot and drill holes in the side of it?

 

[Fenderbender]

And what's the feeding like.. always nutes in the can? or is there a water cycle as well? no problems with overfeeding or lockouts?
I mean you can grow the plant in nutes that's no problem but why is that it can often occur with top feeding plants in pots? Is it because the roots themselves just transport what they need from the nutrient rich area? and you're not soaking the whole pot with nutes force feeding all roots?