Keffka's Recycling, KOS Blue Thai, Herbies Seeds Apple Betty, Runtz Punch

[Keffka]

No smells, or very little unless you're doing it wrong (too wet, too much food at one time, things like that).

That’s what I thought. I was reading over common mistakes and I think I’ll be just fine. They all seem similar to mistakes new growers make borne out of impatience and misunderstanding. Don’t overfeed, moist not wet, be aware of nutrient content and acidity/alkalinity, etc.

 

[Gee64]

I’m in Michigan so it freezes in the fall/winter/spring and gets above 90F during the summer. I was thinking of outside but the temps make me nervous. Do you know if the worms mind being moved around or does that piss them off?



Gahhhh.. I would love a basement. It would solve all of my growing headaches. However I’m experienced enough to know it would come with its own set of headaches I never even thought of




Is there any smell from it? Rev hinted they smell but I was under the impression that was due to an imbalanced environment or over feeding

Once in awhile, after a moist feeding of squash or pumpkin, you can get a slight musty smell that lingers for a day or 2, but otherwise nothing at all. As Azi stated, just don't let them get too wet.

 

[Keffka]

Once in awhile, after a moist feeding of squash or pumpkin, you can get a slight musty smell that lingers for a day or 2, but otherwise nothing at all. As Azi stated, just don't let them get too wet.

I figured as much. I was all ready to set it up in the same room I do my soil then saw Rev mention it smelling which I found odd and hesitated on. From what I understand of the process, there really shouldn’t be much in the way of smell, decomposition isn’t the same thing as rotting and doesn’t produce the same smells.

 

[Stunger]

I’m in Michigan so it freezes in the fall/winter/spring and gets above 90F during the summer. I was thinking of outside but the temps make me nervous. Do you know if the worms mind being moved around or does that piss them off?

I don't think it would be a problem to move them if you had to. In winter time, my worms appear less active than warm weather, but that is probably to be expected. You just don't want them to stress and cook in hot temperatures. But in saying that, it depends how heavy your unit is to lift. With 3 levels mine is heavy and would be a PITA.

I am not aware of any smell from mine. But it would probably depend on what you feed them but shouldn't be an issue.

I used to buy the marketed 'worm blankets', but now I just use a bit of corrugated cardboard that the first time I pre soak in water, they seem to really like that and eventually consume it, then I just do it again. In summer when they can be quite active and move into the lid, I find that keeping a piece of moistened cardboard on top of them seems to keep them happy and they mostly stay underneath it until it needs replacing again.

I did read a long while ago of folk in cold climes who successfully had their worm farms outside and used something like an old quilt or something thick and insulating over the top to keep the temperature above that of the air temperature. That would also help in the heat as you wouldn't want direct strong sunlight falling on it and heating it up.

 

[Keffka]

I don't think it would be a problem to move them if you had to. In winter time, my worms appear less active than warm weather, but that is probably to be expected. You just don't want them to stress and cook in hot temperatures. But in saying that, it depends how heavy your unit is to lift. With 3 levels mine is heavy and would be a PITA.

I am not aware of any smell from mine. But it would probably depend on what you feed them but shouldn't be an issue.

I used to buy the marketed 'worm blankets', but now I just use a bit of corrugated cardboard that the first time I pre soak in water, they seem to really like that and eventually consume it, then I just do it again. In summer when they can be quite active and move into the lid, I find that keeping a piece of moistened cardboard on top of them seems to keep them happy and they mostly stay underneath it until it needs replacing again.

I did read a long while ago of folk in cold climes who successfully had their worm farms outside and used something like an old quilt or something thick and insulating over the top to keep the temperature above that of the air temperature. That would also help in the heat as you wouldn't want direct strong sunlight falling on it and heating it up.

Awesome breakdown, thank you!

It’s so much more helpful hearing (reading technically I guess lol) people’s real world experiences, I appreciate it

 

[Keffka]

I circled the Blue Thais in the first picture. They’re the red cups. Top and middle are 8/9 days old and the bottom is 6 days. Looks like two tall phenos and one squat pheno. I had one of each last run and they both produced outstanding buds, the tall one coming in a little heavier than the squat one.

They’ll be getting transplanted soon. I’m picking up my last bag of EWC this week to get the new containers started before transplant. I should have my own castings ready to go for the next grow.

 

[Keffka]

This is a Blue Thai. I’m hoping it’s female and it continues with its mutantish growth. I’ve had some ugly mutants produce breathtaking flower.

 

[StoneOtter]

Pictures are a 1000 words..and no I haven't seen a sip grow that's trich out compared to other grows in soilless or organics.
Not hating on it but I wouldn't waste 4 months on a grow with it.
Big plants though.
Cheers

Sky Muffin

• StoneOtter
• Dec 1, 2023

Black Poisonberry

• StoneOtter
• Jan 4, 2024

These are jammed Sparkey! You may want to watch my next grow and evaluate again. I disagree with you 100%!

Score.. check it out @Gee64 he covers the dolomite lime recipe.

@StoneOtter he has all of the water information from his website in the new book

Yeah I noticed! He did good there!

I believe that is what @StoneOtter does if I’m not mistaken.

Depending on your water source I don’t see a reason why you couldn’t store it long term.

I do use dolomite water after a while, and I have made vinegar/oyster shell extraction that I haven't used yet.

If I understood it correctly, Rev uses the same containers without ever washing them out. He throws a bubbler in each one and just refills it with water as needed. This helps to build up a lot of aerobic bacteria friendly to his environment from my understanding of his explanation.

Once a year if I remember right.

 

[StoneOtter]

I have a question about recycling soil and the new Rev recipe.
Perlite!
He adds 2 gallons of it on recycle now! I don't get it! It's almost an indestructible element and to add that much every amend to 30 gallons sounds wrong to me! What do you think of that?

 

[Gee64]

I have a question about recycling soil and the new Rev recipe.
Perlite!
He adds 2 gallons of it on recycle now! I don't get it! It's almost an indestructible element and to add that much every amend to 30 gallons sounds wrong to me! What do you think of that?

I haven't read his book yet, so I haven't seen his new recipes, but coco and ewc make it so that I need to add perlite every remix.

 

[StoneOtter]

Looking more at it, he adds earthworm castings or compost as well, as a new amendment. He leaves out coco completely now. That may make the balance I was looking for.
Still seems a lot of pearlite for an amend. So I've amended 4 times say. @ 2 gallons a wack is 8 gallons that is still there.

 

[Keffka]

I have a question about recycling soil and the new Rev recipe.
Perlite!
He adds 2 gallons of it on recycle now! I don't get it! It's almost an indestructible element and to add that much every amend to 30 gallons sounds wrong to me! What do you think of that?

You lose perlite throughout and after the grow without even realizing it. Depending on the grade you’re using it happens for different reasons. On top of that, adding EWC and compost/manure requires more aeration than just plain potting soil. Due to how dense and compacted EWC and compost/manure can get you’re gonna want to cut in extra perlite.

Aeration is probably the single biggest factor in organics that trip people up. You want massive amounts of aeration at all times. Uncomfortable amounts. You don’t want there to be any anaerobic bacteria and you don’t want compaction.

When a plant can receive as much as 30% of its total Nitrogen requirement just from the self sustaining rhizophagy cycle, there is no need to pile in more nutrient content. As long as you keep the environment properly aerated the rhizophagy bacteria can literally pull N out of the air for the plant. This is a closed loop system that requires no input from you if established properly. So aeration is a big, big deal

 

[Gee64]

You lose perlite throughout and after the grow without even realizing it. Depending on the grade you’re using it happens for different reasons. On top of that, adding EWC and compost/manure requires more aeration than just plain potting soil. Due to how dense and compacted EWC and compost/manure can get you’re gonna want to cut in extra perlite.

Aeration is probably the single biggest factor in organics that trip people up. You want massive amounts of aeration at all times. Uncomfortable amounts. You don’t want there to be any anaerobic bacteria and you don’t want compaction.

When a plant can receive as much as 30% of its total Nitrogen requirement just from the self sustaining rhizophagy cycle, there is no need to pile in more nutrient content. As long as you keep the environment properly aerated the rhizophagy bacteria can literally pull N out of the air for the plant. This is a closed loop system that requires no input from you if established properly. So aeration is a big, big deal

If it helps, think of it this way.

Mix the full recipe really well, then instead of adding the exact amount of perlite the recipe states, instead perlite it to your own flavor.

Every type of pot needs a different amount of perlite to run optimally. Sips vs cloth vs hard pot, etc..

Perlite actually confuses people more than you think. It has volume but no food.

Take it out of the picture, mix your soil, then add perlite if needed. If you think perlite is displacing too much food just use a bigger pot.

If you just follow the recipe, the perlite ratio may not end up fitting your needs.

 

[Gee64]

Sky Muffin

• StoneOtter
• Dec 1, 2023

Black Poisonberry

• StoneOtter
• Jan 4, 2024

These are jammed Sparkey! You may want to watch my next grow and evaluate again. I disagree with you 100%!

Yeah I noticed! He did good there!

I do use dolomite water after a while, and I have made vinegar/oyster shell extraction that I haven't used yet.

Once a year if I remember right.

Those are beuaties!

 

[Azimuth]

I have a question about recycling soil and the new Rev recipe.
Perlite!
He adds 2 gallons of it on recycle now! I don't get it! It's almost an indestructible element and to add that much every amend to 30 gallons sounds wrong to me! What do you think of that?

He does say "As you recycle your soil, the perlite also recycles so less and less is added during recycling over time. " P. 73.

 

[Keffka]

He does say "As you recycle your soil, the perlite also recycles so less and less is added during recycling over time. " P. 73.

There are certain areas where I wish he would drill down into the details better, aeration amendments being one. In the 2nd version of TLO he was almost ready to dump perlite from the mixes in favor of pumice. In the third version he’s back to perlite being his number one but only explains its specific benefits and implies that all mixes should have a certain ratio of perlite and just sort of leaves it at that.

I assume this is going to be because he prefers a specific type of container and set of amendments. However as @Gee64 said, Perlite should be viewed in context of your container situation. Plants in the ground don’t need perlite/aeration amendments. Now that I think about it, he probably doesn’t drill down since he prefers those warrior light pots or whatever they’re called

 

[Keffka]

Good God.. I made a mistake and clicked on a story about Minecraft players earlier.

Did you know there are adults that stream video games my kids play, and that there’s an entire industry of these young adults airing out their entire young adult lives with Minecraft as a subtext. I’m gonna go on a back in my day rant lol

Back in my day, when I was a young adult in my 20s I was training to go to war. By the time I was 25 I was married, had a son, been to multiple countries and was on my way to Afghanistan to fight. We were still living our young adult lives with young adult problems like stupid jealousies, insecurities, selfishness, relationship problems, etc. all that classic shit you go through in your 20s that you cringe at in your 30s and laugh at in your 40s. However, we kept that shit private or confined to our groups of friends. It wasn’t the outside worlds business what we were going through. Our subtext was we’re young 20 something’s who are all physically fit and mentally champing at the bit to go to war. That’s a recipe for some seriously messed up shit and lots of line crossing.

I spent a couple hours earlier following a rabbit hole of 20 something young adult Minecraft players. I shouldn’t have done that lol. I don’t know whether I should feel bad, sad, pity, or annoyance. Probably a mix of all that. These poor kids (I wish I could call them adults but none of what I saw was indicative of adults) entire lives and fuckups are happening out in the open on twitter, discord, Reddit, for everyone to see. It’s the same classic young kid shit.

A girl is with a guy, the guy is still finding himself and insecure, the girl is the exact same. Guys priorities are wrong and pushes his girl away so she finds attention from his best friend. Shit blows up of course. Now they’re all arguing and throwing accusations for everyone to see. All of this is taking place amongst Minecraft streamers so they keep mentioning creating content or Minecraft in the middle of these arguments that are occurring online and I’m just dying. The word choices and the things they’re saying sound almost identical to the shit we were saying and doing but again, the subtext was the Army, not Minecraft lol.

They’re talking about drinking and partying and Consent, and I’m struggling to envision Minecraft players doing this because to me, my 9 year old plays Minecraft. My 13 year old thinks it’s for babies and little kids.

So I definitely spent a couple hours of my life following this entire drama playing out and feel so many conflicting feelings over what I read

 

[SmokingWings]

I used to buy the marketed 'worm blankets', but now I just use a bit of corrugated cardboard that the first time I pre soak in water, they seem to really like that and eventually consume it, then I just do it again. In summer when they can be quite active and move into the lid, I find that keeping a piece of moistened cardboard on top of them seems to keep them happy and they mostly stay underneath it until it needs replacing again.

I did read a long while ago of folk in cold climes who successfully had their worm farms outside and used something like an old quilt or something thick and insulating over the top to keep the temperature above that of the air temperature. That would also help in the heat as you wouldn't want direct strong sunlight falling on it and heating it up.

If the worm beds can be buried then how about digging a hole and putting the beds in and covering with a thick layer of leaves, straw and any other loose fluffy organic materials. Sort of the way gardeners have stored root crops in the garden and pulling what they need from the ground and putting all the leaves back till they need more.

I put corrugated cardboard down as a barrier on my walkways through the garden. Then it is covered with a couple of inches of grass clippings. Most of it is gone after the first season. If the walkway will still be in the same place than another layer is added. Otherwise it gets turned over and a new walk is built somewhere else. Best to remove any and all tape and labels first.

 

[StoneOtter]

You lose perlite throughout and after the grow without even realizing it. Depending on the grade you’re using it happens for different reasons. On top of that, adding EWC and compost/manure requires more aeration than just plain potting soil. Due to how dense and compacted EWC and compost/manure can get you’re gonna want to cut in extra perlite.

Aeration is probably the single biggest factor in organics that trip people up. You want massive amounts of aeration at all times. Uncomfortable amounts. You don’t want there to be any anaerobic bacteria and you don’t want compaction.

When a plant can receive as much as 30% of its total Nitrogen requirement just from the self sustaining rhizophagy cycle, there is no need to pile in more nutrient content. As long as you keep the environment properly aerated the rhizophagy bacteria can literally pull N out of the air for the plant. This is a closed loop system that requires no input from you if established properly. So aeration is a big, big deal

I guess it's more fragile than I figured. Shoot! My soil needs air!
The original recipe had none in the amend. I'm glad to have this conversation before making my pots! The Rev is focusing on small sized so I'll pick up a bag.

Those are beuaties!

Thanks! They weren't without good frost. My opinion on SIP growing is that a SIP will grow super frosty bud if we choose to do a few things like, grow a plant with manageable branches, and keep them from lower larf. They can get too branchy and buddy if we let them from my limited experience so far in a SIP. It's the old fewer branches = better bud theory.

 

[Keffka]

I guess it's more fragile than I figured. Shoot! My soil needs air!
The original recipe had none in the amend. I'm glad to have this conversation before making my pots! The Rev is focusing on small sized so I'll pick up a bag.

He must’ve realized along the way that perlite eventually breaks into dust or gets jostled out. He’s a bit all over the place with it though. He’ll list a specific amount in one recipe then turn around and say 1 part perlite to 4 part soil. Then he’ll turn around and tell you to run it at 20% to start and 10% after that. So I can see how it gets muddled.

Perlite isn’t a part of my recipe. I add it after everything else at around 10-15% of the total soil volume. The only time I add it before everything else is when I’m adding large amounts of EWC to the mix. EWC needs to be aerated, it’s so dense.

. It's the old fewer branches = better bud theory

Plant tissue data has shown that the fewer shoots a plant has, the greater its calcium and Nitrogen efficiency is. This would lead to better built, more high quality buds.