Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL - LED

[B A R]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

GhettoGro you're a gem! You just solved my dilemma. I'll just cut the width poles to 2ft; those last 8inches is where the problem lies. Thanxx.

 

[Sorenna]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

hey, i'm gonna be a dad soon, what am I in for? Found out ITS A BOY! Love your grows Sue, thanks for spreading the knowledge. You've inspired me to start a worm bin soon.

Congratulations on your little one!

 

[GhettoGro]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

I didn't actually cut the poles, I "rigged" it. Sue has seen my rigging. I will feature my ghetto flower tent in my next grow update. Y'all will laugh, but it works..haha

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

As I prepare to crack the dialysis fluid boxes to keep them flat, I turn to Dale and we both grin and begin to laugh as we both hear, in the back of our minds "No weasels were cracked or otherwise harmed in the making of this name."

Thank you Weaselcracker for that daily belly laugh.

We've had some really good laughs today. When I came through the door he was almost non responsive to my effervescence, and when I questioned him he flatly responded

"I have no emotion."

For some reason that sent me into a fit of giggles that escalated into tears of laughter. Maybe because it's the Avengers release weekend, but I suddenly had a string of super villain names swirl across my brain, all geared to non-expressiveness. Total silliness that had both of us laughing hard after he finally let the guard down.

Even in this little hell-hole of a nursing home you can't keep joy at bay.

 

[Sorenna]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Daily Update: Dark Devil Auto - Day 44

I started with the 1/4 turn of the pot and then started taking pictures. Sorenna had mentioned yesterday that not everyone has a PC that will load the pictures in easily. I'm ashamed to say that I've been so lost in the joy of posting cannabis glamour shots from my tiny closet that I'd never considered that I would be causing someone frustration in doing so. I work exclusively with either the iPad or my iPhone, so I never have any problem with it. Is this a common problem? I'm hoping not, because although I culled them down there's still a number of them. Please forgive me my indulgence. It's so hard to reign it in.

Oh, goodness SweetSue, when I said that, it certainly wasnt a dig at you for the amount of pictures you post. Not even at all! I just have a gaming computer that is built for graphics and I know not everyone does, thats all. Perhaps its not an issue for anyone, Im erring on the side of caution.

I hate to say it, but your Devil looks far more like an angel. Shes lovely, as ever.

 

[NuttyProfessor]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

the picture of health and beauty

 

[36Gr0w]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Saponins

Saponins trigger the plant's SAR (defense system), helping the plant stay healthy and naturally pest resistant. Think of it as a secondary line of defense in your Integrated Pest Management (IPM) approach, behind neem, Tulsi Basil, aloe vera, kelp and fulvics.

Saponins added to foliar sprays are called surfactants. When applied to soil they are called wetting agents.

Some comparisons of saponin levels

alfalfa - 20,000 ppm
aloe vera - 30,000 ppm
yucca extract - 40,000 ppm
horse chestnuts - 140,000 ppm
soap nuts - 240,000 ppm

I need to stop at the Indian grocery and pick up some soap nuts.

Using Soap Nuts

1. Soak 2 seeds in a bucket with 4 gallons of good water for 24 hours.
Dilute to make 20-25 gallons

2. Soak 1 seed in 5 gallons of good water. Use as is. No diluting necessary.

** This brew will only keep for a day. Make what you need or make a big batch, freeze in ice cube trays and store in ziplock freezer bags until needed.

Soap Nuts Solution

Break open a seed.
Let the shell sit in a cup of good water for 24 hours. The water will be light brown.
Pour into a bucket and dilute as needed at a rate of 1 TBS/gallon

Sue, is it the Saponin triggering a SAR, or is it the Salicylic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ?

On the subject of SAR (Systemic acquired resistance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia), have you done any reading on Jasmonic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ?

Wiki links is starting reading, look elsewhere for more in depth info and studies.

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Oh, goodness SweetSue, when I said that, it certainly wasnt a dig at you for the amount of pictures you post. Not even at all! I just have a gaming computer that is built for graphics and I know not everyone does, thats all. Perhaps its not an issue for anyone, Im erring on the side of caution.

I hate to say it, but your Devil looks far more like an angel. Shes lovely, as ever.

I didn't take it like that Sorenna. I'm fairly thick-skinned, and I've a reputation for these enticing pictures that must be upheld.

My daughter takes great pride in inspiring me to let myself become familiar with finding "The Shot". She's a one-shot wizard with her iPhone and comes up with shots that her friends who are professional photographers droll over. Once I stopped looking for the shot and letting it find me it got easier. That also meant I was taking more pictures and posting more decent shots. Apparently the crew enjoys them and I have no intention of stopping the practice. I will, however, attempt to cull out superfluous or redundant shots. Not making any promises though. They're hard to resist.

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Sue, is it the Saponin triggering a SAR, or is it the Salicylic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ?

On the subject of SAR (Systemic acquired resistance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia), have you done any reading on Jasmonic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ?

Wiki links is starting reading, look elsewhere for more in depth info and studies.

Ahh 36, a research project for the day. Let's see if I can figure that out by this evening.

 

[36Gr0w]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Found this little gem from 2013 while just roaming around researching saponins. A neat idea from Mr Coot.

"So while you're at Whole Foods pick-up Cilantro (organic ONLY) and when you get home toss the entire bunch (sans the tie around the middle) into a food processor with enough water to make a slurry or puree.

Add this to 1 gallon of clear water and let it sit for 36 - 48 hours. No more than this.

Add 1 cup of strained Cilantro tea to 15 cups of water = 1 gallon. Allow for 1/4 cup of Aloe vera juice and use 1 tsp. of Pro-TeKt.

Wait until the it's almost "light's out" and spray the top of the soil, every branch, every leaf from top to bottom. You want the plant to look like you haven't watered in several days and it's drooping big time.

Leave the ventilation system going and by morning you won't have anything hopping, flying, whatever in your chamber. Follow this up every 4 days until you're completed 4 applications.

Done. Finis. Ovah.

This is not a pesticide in the usual definition and without a long explanation you might need to trust me on this one - I apply this and other 'Mint' teas to hydrate the soil every couple of weeks.

"Bio Stimulants"

If you're concerned then pick-up a couple of throw-away plants at Home Depot - Marigolds are a good one. Water this plant with your Cilantro mix and see for yourself.

HTH

CC"

 

[Doc Bud]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Found this little gem from 2013 while just roaming around researching saponins. A neat idea from Mr Coot.

"So while you're at Whole Foods pick-up Cilantro (organic ONLY) and when you get home toss the entire bunch (sans the tie around the middle) into a food processor with enough water to make a slurry or puree.

Add this to 1 gallon of clear water and let it sit for 36 - 48 hours. No more than this.

Add 1 cup of strained Cilantro tea to 15 cups of water = 1 gallon. Allow for 1/4 cup of Aloe vera juice and use 1 tsp. of Pro-TeKt.

Wait until the it's almost "light's out" and spray the top of the soil, every branch, every leaf from top to bottom. You want the plant to look like you haven't watered in several days and it's drooping big time.

Leave the ventilation system going and by morning you won't have anything hopping, flying, whatever in your chamber. Follow this up every 4 days until you're completed 4 applications.

Done. Finis. Ovah.

This is not a pesticide in the usual definition and without a long explanation you might need to trust me on this one - I apply this and other 'Mint' teas to hydrate the soil every couple of weeks.

"Bio Stimulants"

If you're concerned then pick-up a couple of throw-away plants at Home Depot - Marigolds are a good one. Water this plant with your Cilantro mix and see for yourself.

HTH

CC"

Just a heads-up.....you can accomplish the same thing with plain water.....except the gnats. The method you describe above will work for mites and thripes, but not for gnats.

I know, I know, you got the recipe from a trusted source, etc. You'll still have gnats. Wait till they fill that tent and swarm in your house when you open it......

Then again, I haven't had gnats for a few years...mites either. So I might be a little behind on how to kill them. My plants and soil take care of that for me so I don't have to worry about it.

 

[GhettoGro]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Usually i would recommend a light neem additive to your next watering. But, I have never grown with live soil. Don't want to kill the good stuff, right?

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

While I haven't been able to find any evidence supporting the claim that saponins trigger SAR in plants, I did come across a very technical paper that suggested that there isn't evidence that salicylic acid is the trigger either, although it's more widely accepted that it may be. That study hinted at lipids. Too deep for me to follow.

I did, however, increase my knowledge of saponins and now understand that their chief values may be in insect control (see below) and as a wetting agent or surfactant.

Fun Fact
The saponins found in oats and spinach increase and accelerate the body's ability to absorb calcium and silicon, thus assisting in digestion.

So eat that oatmeal and spinach.


Using Wetting Agents (Nonionic Surfactants) on Soil
​
Source:
Department of Soil Science - North Carolina State University

Some soils, known as hydrophobic soils, are difficult to wet because they repel water. The infiltration of water into these soils can often be improved by applying a nonionic surfactant, more commonly called a wetting agent. Wetting agents are detergent-like substances that reduce the surface tension of water, allowing it to penetrate and wet the soil more easily.
To understand how wetting agents work, it is necessary to know something about the three forces that affect the movement of water into the soil. The first is gravity; it is a constant force that pulls the water downward. The second is cohesion, the attraction of water molecules for each other. It is the force that holds a droplet of water together. It creates the droplet's surface tension, which causes the droplet to behave as if a thin, flexible film covered its surface, tending to keep the water molecules apart from other substances. The third force is adhesion, the attraction of water molecules to other substances. This force causes water molecules to adhere to other objects, such as soil particles.
Tests have also been conducted to determine whether wetting agents have any toxic effects on plants. In tests on barley shoots grown hydroponically (that is, in a nutrient solution rather than in soil), a wetting agent concentration of 300 parts per million (ppm) in the solution caused a reduction of about 70 percent in the dry weight of the shoots. However, the same concentration in water applied to shoots growing in soil or in a sand-peat mixture increased shoot growth slightly. When wetting agents are applied to soil, the concentration would have to be much higher than 300 ppm before plant growth would be impaired.

Despite frequent irrigation, the soil in these spots resists wetting, resulting in patches of dead or severely wilted turf. The water applied wets the turf but does not adequately penetrate the soil surface to reach the root zone.

but the most effective solution was to use wetting agents in combination with coring–making small holes in the soil surface to allow water to pass through the hydrophobic surface layer. Also, keeping the soil moist seemed to be the best defense against the development of dry spots. Allowing the soil to dry out intensified the problem.
Several studies have shown that the infiltration rate of a hydrophobic soil, once it has been wetted, remains higher than it was before it was wetted, even if it is allowed to dry out again.



From Novel Advances with Plant Saponins as Natural Insecticides to Control Pest Insects
Ellen De Geyter - Ellen Lambert - Danny Geelen - Guy Smagghe. (Bold is my own)

Saponins possess clear insecticidal activities: they exert a strong and rapid-working action against a broad range of pest insects that is different from neurotoxicity. The most observed effects are increased mortality, lowered food intake, weight reduction, retardation in development and decreased reproduction. According to the main hypotheses in literature, saponins exert a repellent/deterrent activity, bear digestive problems, provoke insect moulting defects or cause cellular toxicity effects. As a consequence these interesting plant components open new strategies to protect crops in modern agriculture and horticulture with integrated pest management (IPM) programs against pest insects, either by spraying, or by selecting high-saponin varieties of commercial crops.

MECHANISMS UNDERLYING THE ACTION (OF SAPONINS) AGAINST INSECTS
Repellent or deterrent activity
Slowing down the passage of food through the gut
Blocking sterol uptake
Antagonistic or competitive activity on the ecdysteroid Membrane-permeabilising abilities

Now, let me look into Jasmonic acid.

 

[Duggan]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

I know Scarfinger, so much to consider. Having my electrician husband dealing with an amputation when he was supposed to be doing my electrical is throwing a wrench into the plans too. Life and its little challenges.

Hey SS....I didn't know your Dale was a sparky!! Cheers eh.

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Just a heads-up.....you can accomplish the same thing with plain water.....except the gnats. The method you describe above will work for mites and thripes, but not for gnats.

I know, I know, you got the recipe from a trusted source, etc. You'll still have gnats. Wait till they fill that tent and swarm in your house when you open it......

Then again, I haven't had gnats for a few years...mites either. So I might be a little behind on how to kill them. My plants and soil take care of that for me so I don't have to worry about it.

I'm not playing softball with the gnats anymore Doc. I have neem seed meal coming, which I should have started with. A few applications and the gnats will diminish and vanish. I have complete confidence in that. I think I'm going to incorporate some soap nuts though and see if that can get rid of the larvae a bit faster. That ability of saponins to interfere with larval digestion caught my eye today.

Just to clarify though, what would water alone accomplish without the benefit of the cilantro or a member of the mint family normally chosen for pest resistance?

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Usually i would recommend a light neem additive to your next watering. But, I have never grown with live soil. Don't want to kill the good stuff, right?

Good call GhettoGro. As soon as the neem cake arrives I will begin to incorporate it into integrated pest management. Next up will be karanja oil for weekly foliars, but I can't do that until next month. Before long there will be no pests to speak of. It's unthinkable to me, given the regular diet of enzyme teas, coconut water, aloe vera juice, silica, fulvic acid, humic acid, kelp meal and neem meal that my soil would continue to have any pest concerns. It's just a matter of letting the soil get strong enough to resist the pests. With no-till you take the long term approach. I'm building soil that will serve my needs without tilling for years to come. It's not something that happens overnight.

All LOS farmers of indoor plots apparently have a stage where they farm gnats. It's a temporary situation that isn't holding my plants back at all.

And Doc, the gnats have already claimed my home. Now we share the dwelling. Only temporary.

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

Hey SS....I didn't know your Dale was a sparky!! Cheers eh.

One of his many talents Duggan. I may have to call on you when I get around to hooking up the ventilation system. I have no idea what I'm doing and he's locked into this nursing home for another month it looks like. AAAAAARRRRGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!

When I get ready to hook up maybe we can set a time and you can look over my shoulder so I don't screw it up? I still have to figure out how to afford it. Haven't taken the time to pay the bills yet. Maybe tonight would be a good time for that.

I haven't looked at systems yet. Any recommendations?

 

[36Gr0w]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

No gnats in my grow room! Tons of organic matter being kept constantly moist with a swick and mulch.

Gnats are easy to get rid of lol. Why the doubt about Cilantro Doc?

I suppose unless some active ingredient in cilantro kills the larvae, the Cilantro may be pointless for gnats. Have you not had success with the bti mosquito dunks Sue?

 

[SweetSue]

Re: Sweetsue's Tiny Closet - Second Grow - Sweet Dark Devil & Bomb Berry Bomb - CFL -

That claim to increase trichome production by 50% using a combination of well-timed applications of gibberlns and Jasmonic acid is certainly enticing. If one could learn to get the timing just right...... An interesting approach, mimic the stress of an insect attack to stimulate trichome production.

I came across info that suggested an effective approach would be to somehow apply gibberillic acid and then drop freshly cut pieces of sagebrush around the stem of the plant you want to influence. Just as effective but way less expensive than Jasmonic acid.

Kelp - an excellent natural source of gibberellins. Would cut sagebrush and a kelp foliar do the trick?

Thanks 36. I love learning.